157 replies to this topic

[Rong Qin Wang]

East Han: Liu Xiu （光武中兴）

Zunjing de China History Forum members,

Hmm, there is one thing that has been on my mind for a few days now. What would be the English translation of the above? Would it be “Guang Wu Restoration/Resurgence?” I surmise the reigns of Chinese Emperors can be classified into three categories; restoration/resurgence (It has the same two Chinese characters above; however, I have no idea what is the Pinyin transliteration for it), Zhi Zhi, and Sheng Shi. Restoration/resurgence was used to describe a reign that succeeded a period of decline that succeeded a period of prosperity. Zhi Zhi meant the period of great rule. Sheng Shi would refer to an era of extreme prosperity.

Can someone please tell me if I have gotten the correct terms and the right definitions?

Xie Xie,

[General Guan Yu]

Although Qianlong was regarded 'good' in both martial (military) and literary skills of making Qing dynasty powerful (i.e. during his time, Qing reached the zenith of its power and territorial expansion and prosperity), I would not say he's a truly great emperor unlike his grandfather Kangxi.

Qianlong was blindfolded by He Shen, one of the most corrupt officials during Qing dynasty. After Qianlong died, his son Jia Qing took over and confiscated He Shen's property. It was discovered that He Shen's 'wealth' which he obtained from corrupt practice of bribery, amounted to almost 10 years the imperial revenue of Qing dynasty.

He Shen was the direct cause for the decline of Qing dynasty, b'cos after him, the imperial coffer become vacant. He also resulted in increasing conflict between the landlord and the peasants. A few years after Qian long passed away, China faced several social unrest that almost brought the decline of Qing dynasty.

Furthermore, Qianlong was wrong in closing up China to outside world. His reason for closing up China is that he felt China is self-sufficient and that any 'external trade will only corrupt the practice of Chinese'. At that time, Chinese trade with foreign countries were only limited to Canton city. This closure of China resulted in the increasing backward of the Qing technology, culiminating in their defeat during Opium war of 1842.

I don't really agree with you. Though during Qian Long's time, he did has a closed door policy and chase all the European's missionaries and traders out of China, he was actually left with no choice. The westerners were bring harmful products into China then and to protect his kingdom, any emperor will do what Qian Long had done. If I was born during that period of time, given my cultural background, I will do likewise.

As for his employment of He Shen into the imperial court and putting him in good use, any Emperor will definitely be blinded by acts of these villains. But is He Shen really a villain? In the eyes of history, he only pocketed money and wealth. This can only be labelled as selfish and greedy. But did he betray his Master (who is Emperor Qian Long) or China? Well, I dun think he is a betrayer? If so, is he that bad?

[Whsie]

I don't really agree with you. Though during Qian Long's time, he did has a closed door policy and chase all the European's missionaries and traders out of China, he was actually left with no choice. The westerners were bring harmful products into China then and to protect his kingdom, any emperor will do what Qian Long had done. If I was born during that period of time, given my cultural background, I will do likewise.

As for his employment of He Shen into the imperial court and putting him in good use, any Emperor will definitely be blinded by acts of these villains. But is He Shen really a villain? In the eyes of history, he only pocketed money and wealth. This can only be labelled as selfish and greedy. But did he betray his Master (who is Emperor Qian Long) or China? Well, I dun think he is a betrayer? If so, is he that bad?

I beg to differ.
The Westerners didn't really start the "harmful products" until the 1800s. The Westerners were seeking trade. The massive import of opium didn't start until Dao Guang.
If I was George McCarthy and got insulted like that, I would have started to have ill intentions as well. And btw, did you know that George brought along some cannons and updated weapons to the Qing Dynasty? It was found when the Yuan Ming Yuan was looted.
To me, one of the major downers is his use of money. He should have used it to update the weapons which were still the ones used in the late 1600s and early 1700s. Instead, he used the money on luxurious buildings and other pointless things. By the end of his reign, the Qing were starting to feel the effects of an empty treasury.

yeah, blinded. If Qianlong was so good, he wouldn't have been blinded. Kangxi wasn't during his reign.
yes, He Shen is really that much of a villian since he started the massive corruption that lasted all the way to end of the Qing Dynasty and continued to this very day.

[枫叶守望者]

First things first: I am from GanSu China,if there is anyone knows this province in northeast China.
This topic reminds me of one history class in my junior high:my history teacher asked us to list 5 emperors whom we considered the most famous in the past thousands of years.It took me only 10 mins before I gave up,bacause I found it was really hard to list 5(or even 10).The names you put on the list depends on the aspect from which you see this problem. i.e. if I am going to list top 10 on military issues,maybe Qin Shi Huang will be on the top,but if I consider more about the economical things, Tang Taizong will be on the top. So I think it might be better to narrow down this "top 10",to list several top 10s from diferent aspcts instead of just generally saying "top 10 emperors of Chinese history".
This is only my point of view,PLEASE correct me if I am wrong.Thanks

Edited by 枫叶守望者, 28 July 2007 - 08:32 PM.

[shunyadragon]

I have compiles a list of the top ten emperors of China
1) Qin Shi Huang
2) Han Gao Zu
3) Han Wu Di
4) Tang Tai Zong
5) Wu Zei Tian
6) Tang Ming Huang
7) Kublai Khan
8) Ming Tai Zu
9) Kang Xi
10) Qian Long
Do you agree with the list or do you have another list?

If no one has nominated him before this, I vote for Mao Ze Dong (Mao Tse Tung), the last emperor

Edited by shunyadragon, 28 September 2007 - 10:03 PM.

[Publius]

If no one has nominated him before this, I vote for Mao Ze Dong (Mao Tse Tung), the last emperor

And in what respect had Mao Zedong ever claimed to be the last emperor?

(Please don't answer that, it was heavily rhetorical since Mao Zedong never claimed this and communist China has never claimed to be a monarchy)

[shunyadragon]

And in what respect had Mao Zedong ever claimed to be the last emperor?

(Please don't answer that, it was heavily rhetorical since Mao Zedong never claimed this and communist China has never claimed to be a monarchy)

A horse need not claim to be a horse to be a horse.

[Korin]

LOL last emperor was of Manchu Qing Dynasty. Mao was just a fat boy.