9 replies to this topic

[kaiselin]

I am starting this thread as a spin off from
Replying to Traditional Chinese Chops/Stamps Post #324
http://www.chinahist...mp;qpid=4928136

When we were talking about trying to choose a name for me, he got very involved! I think that he was treating this name as my "style" name, and was very concerned that the numerology of the characters was auspicious. In the end, I think we were both happy. Good luck with finding your own name!

I know how to find the numerology or western names, but I have never seen how to determine the numerology of Chinese Characters..

Is there any way to determine the number of a character besides taking its sound spelled out and use the Western style association with each letter representing a number?

Does anyone have any information on this?

I am going to guess it might have something to do with the magic squares used in Fengshui, but beyond that I haven't the slightest clue.

Edited by kaiselin, 07 March 2008 - 01:04 PM.

[tealeaf]

I am starting this thread as a spin off from
Replying to Traditional Chinese Chops/Stamps Post #324
http://www.chinahist...mp;qpid=4928136





I know how to find the numerology or western names, but I have never seen how to determine the numerology of Chinese Characters..

Is there any way to determine the number of a character besides taking its sound spelled out and use the Western style association with each letter representing a number?

Does anyone have any information on this?

I am going to guess it might have something to do with the magic squares used in Fengshui, but beyond that I haven't the slightest clue.

I don't understand how it works, but the two websites that my friend linked to were:

http://name.nothing.tw/
http://www.veryname..../star/standard/

I think that it might have something to do with the number of strokes in the characters, and possibly the nature of the radicals. I don't understand Chinese enough to understand those websites, though. I'd be interested to find out more.

[fireball]

You have to follow the exactly designated radicals' strokes as well as the designated strokes of other parts of the words defined in Chinese dictionary -- I think the Kangxi dictionary -- the information there came from older dictionaries. For example, the radical for the character 華 (hua2 or China) is 屾, so its strokes are 6 and NOT 4. A lot of times, people who don't know this field or Chinese too well would really get it wrong in these cases!!! Also, 華's other strokes are defined to be 8 strokes, so the total strokes to write the character 華 is really 6+8 = 14 no matter how you write it. If I write the word 華, I will come up with 11 strokes and Not the real 14 strokes defined in the Chinese dictionaries. Why use Kangxi dictionary? I read about it in one of the Chinese Fortune Telling books. Kangxi dictionary happened to be the last really official Chinese dictionary, so the later Fortune Tellers all use that as the standard. The latest dictionaries published in mainland China, Taiwan, Hong Kong should all base their radicals and strokes on the Kangxi dictionary. However, they are all not as carefully edited as the Kangxi dictionary -- I think the scholars became very careful in their editing and collection works if their mistakes were going to cause their heads and/or their family members' heads or freedom as in the Imperial time of Kangxi Emperor. The modern scholars have/had no such pressure over their heads!

In addition, the numbers also represent Yin and Yang and 5 elements, etc. It has a lot of details, but I haven't read these stuff for about 30 years, so I forgot most of them. I think the even numbers are Yin, and the odd numbers are Yang. I am not quite sure about the 5 elements and which number(s) is (are) associated with which element? I assume or sort of remember it was associated with the 10 天干 (tian1 gan1). Btw, 0=even number=Yin. Please see: http://en.wikipedia..../Celestial_stem.

Please also see: http://en.wikipedia....ber_definitions. However, it does not show the 5 elements associations with the numbers.

Added info:
From the websites provided by tealeaf, it looks like the way you write the characters would also impact your name. For example, I write 華's other strokes in about 7 strokes and NOT the defined 8 strokes. Therefore, my calculation for 華 should be 6 + 7 = 13 and not the defined 14 strokes.

Edited by fireball, 07 March 2008 - 03:18 PM.

[kaiselin]

You have to follow the exactly designated radicals' strokes as well as the designated strokes of other parts of the words defined in Chinese dictionary -- I think the Kangxi dictionary -- the information there came from older dictionaries. For example, the radical for the character 華 (hua2 or China) is 屾, so its strokes are 6 and NOT 4. A lot of times, people who don't know this field or Chinese too well would really get it wrong in these cases!!! Also, 華's other strokes are defined to be 8 strokes, so the total strokes to write the character 華 is really 6+8 = 14 no matter how you write it. If I write the word 華, I will come up with 11 strokes and Not the real 14 strokes defined in the Chinese dictionaries. Why use Kangxi dictionary? I read about it in one of the Chinese Fortune Telling books. Kangxi dictionary happened to be the last really official Chinese dictionary, so the later Fortune Tellers all use that as the standard. The latest dictionaries published in mainland China, Taiwan, Hong Kong should all base their radicals and strokes on the Kangxi dictionary. However, they are all not as carefully edited as the Kangxi dictionary -- I think the scholars became very careful in their editing and collection works if their mistakes were going to cause their heads and/or their family members' heads or freedom as in the Imperial time of Kangxi Emperor. The modern scholars have/had no such pressure over their heads!

In addition, the numbers also represent Yin and Yang and 5 elements, etc. It has a lot of details, but I haven't read these stuff for about 30 years, so I forgot most of them. I think the even numbers are Yin, and the odd numbers are Yang. I am not quite sure about the 5 elements and which number(s) is (are) associated with which element? I assume or sort of remember it was associated with the 10 天干 (tian1 gan1). Btw, 0=even number=Yin. Please see: http://en.wikipedia..../Celestial_stem.

Please also see: http://en.wikipedia....ber_definitions. However, it does not show the 5 elements associations with the numbers.

Added info:
From the websites provided by tealeaf, it looks like the way you write the characters would also impact your name. For example, I write 華's other strokes in about 7 strokes and NOT the defined 8 strokes. Therefore, my calculation for 華 should be 6 + 7 = 13 and not the defined 14 strokes.

Wow ! ! ! Lots of info Thanks Fireball.

I was wondering if the strokes might be a way that they could be calculated.

I followed most of your post, but am totally confused about 華 (hua2 or China) is 屾.

I understand how you come up with six as the number of strokes for 屾 .

How is 屾 a radical ? I have seen that character listed in ancient characters, but never as a radical.

In what way does it related to 華 ???

Edited by kaiselin, 07 March 2008 - 05:46 PM.

[kaiselin]

Ok, I went looking to try and figure out what I was missing...

you have two mountains 屾 I forgot that the traditional radical for Hua is grass 艸

Which not only looks similar, but when I copied and pasted the first character for grass, it came out looking just like 屾

I have never seen 艸 writen like屾 Is this a normal "shorthand" that I just have never run across before?

So this is closer to the character you are referring to.

Edited by kaiselin, 07 March 2008 - 06:12 PM.

[fireball]

I thought I had 艸 there, but I guess I accidentally clicked on 屾. 艸 is the radical for 華. 屾 is something else all together. Also, 艸 becomes 艹 in the character of 華. I guess I was very sleepy and also in a hurry to go to my conference, so I am not paying attention. Sorry about it. Anyway, just follow the character's dictionary definition and don't mind my Chinese typing. I only started with the Chinese computer input about 5 months ago.

[kaiselin]

Added info:
From the websites provided by tealeaf, it looks like the way you write the characters would also impact your name. For example, I write 華's other strokes in about 7 strokes and NOT the defined 8 strokes. Therefore, my calculation for 華 should be 6 + 7 = 13 and not the defined 14 strokes.

In using 華 and an example, do you continue adding the numbers together just like you do in western numerology until you are down to one digit?

6+7= 13 --- 1+3=4
or depending on the strokes
6+8=14--- 1+4 = 5

Do you always count it as the Kangxi?
Even if you write it in the currant traditional which I can count as either a total of 12 , 11 or 10 depening on if you separtate the crosses or use one line to conect both virticl lines of grass.
And what about the simplified character 华 . If you used that as your signature, the count would be 6

[fireball]

In using 華 and an example, do you continue adding the numbers together just like you do in western numerology until you are down to one digit?

6+7= 13 --- 1+3=4
or depending on the strokes
6+8=14--- 1+4 = 5

Not necessarily. I think it depends on what you are trying to do. I remember reading something about counting down to one digit for certain stuff. I think it also has something related to calculating the 8 characters of your birthdays or something. However, that was very long time ago when I read that, and I don't quite remember how to do it at all. I think it also has something to do with the ways some of the Chinese Fortune Tellers using the sections on their fingers to calculate stuff. I have never really learned that, so I couldn't tell you.

Do you always count it as the Kangxi?

That was what I have read. Whether it is now changed, I have no idea?

Even if you write it in the currant traditional which I can count as either a total of 12 , 11 or 10 depening on if you separtate the crosses or use one line to conect both virticl lines of grass.
And what about the simplified character 华 . If you used that as your signature, the count would be 6

You must count the strokes of the radicals in Kangxi dictionary. However, the two web sites said that you should count the rest of the strokes in the way you usually write that word. Therefore, count it whichever ways you are most comfortable writing it with. I have no idea how you would count the simplified character since some of them, like 华, do not have the same forms at all!!! Anyway, from what I know, 华's simplified form had been around for many years (before this new simplified method had been introduced to mainland China). The book I have read about counting according to the Kangxi dictionary was made after 华 was simplified. Therefore, I would guess the author basically said that one should always use the traditional characters and the Kangxi method to count it -- Please don't ask me about the part of count the rest as you write it!!! I really think the author did not even think of the simplified characters at all!! IMO, the person who came up this method had his/her reasons, and that was a long time ago. I really do not think the modern day Fortune Tellers would know the theories behind this method, so I think one should definitely use the traditional characters and the Kangxi dictionary as the basis and totally forget about the simplified characters, just in case. I think the person should just use the actual dictionary's definitions of strokes instead of how the person writes it. Besides, I have not heard of the claims of those two web sites, so I am not sure they are right or wrong. I think someone else would know more than me on this. Personally, I would use the Kangxi definitions and totally forget about how I would write them.

[General_Zhaoyun]

I don't know how the exact mathematical calculation is, but "numerology of chinese characters" are simply known in chinese as "Ce Zi 测字" (literally "testing your character"). It can be used for divination of life based on how many strokes a character is.

[Booppy]

I know nothing about numerology of Chinese characters, and therefore have no information to add, other than the info of personal experience. I was told a number of years ago--sixteen years, to be exact, at the age of twenty-eight--that my Chinese name was very unlucky. So I had my Chinese name changed. After that, I started to feel more "alive", whereas before I always felt pretty "dead" and hardly noticed anything around me and had very little opportunities other than being in psychotherapy, which didn't work. Anyway, I didn't understand how my Chinese name could influence my life. But today, I read about numerology and how one's name's letters are equated to numbers. That got me thinking that maybe my Chinese name was associated with numerology. Chinese characters are different from letters, but I'm sure it works much the same way.
Why did I spend so many of my early years under a "curse" before it was found out? Maybe it's karma from another life?