41 replies to this topic

[SNK_1408]

Amazing thread!
so far I've never heard of MA expert that can deflect or block arrows, may be lucky to block one arrow in real life.

May be if the contest was one on one and sword man was expert and very quick and given it was windy and hard to see the target, so in this way the sword man can block arrow fired from standard archer.

You can't really block or deflect arrows fired by expert archer, archery was ultimate weapon of choice at the distance before the gun was invented. Rain of arrows? my god, no one can survive that..

I've seen some Chinese, Japanese and Korean movies showing warrior or generals blocking & dodging arrows, what a rubbish, they didn't dodged (may be one or two..), they used the shield to block arrows. and these men wore best armor to protect themselves from arrows and flying objects (like dagger).

Both spear & sword men will carry shields, shield is for block their bodies from javelin & arrows.

Did you guys knows, archery was always deployed at first engagement of fight? then after they finish with arrows, they deploy cavalry to chase archers & supporting infantry, then spearmen to block cavalry force then follow by hand to hand combat with sword, battleaxe, iron bar .. all kind of weapons that can hurt/kill the opponents.

Archery is particularly useful at defensive stand, if the enemy is getting close to it, they always use the long spear to stop them getting close. It's very hard to fight spearman and archers at distance, when you chase archers, they will stand back & try to fire arrows at you, normally the chaser will dodge or lie low to avoid getting hit, that's normal behavior of human.

If anyone have experienced with weaponry, then they will know exactly what is mean to fight archers & spearmen. It's damed hard, believed me I've tried before when I visited war museum where they some exhibition from medieval period, with demonstration.

Please note, all these Fungfu and Samurai MA action movies are made for enjoyment and mostly they are exaggerated and contains impossible moves.

[bayonet]

Getting hit by an arrow should feel like getting kicked by a horse, or if lucky, getting punched by a boxer. All these might give rise to the impression that archers are not dangerous, not unless your warbow is made of jade or some rare material.

i was once kicked by a horse on the back of my waist by its rear legs. it was painful but not unbearable. Wonder what it feel like getting hit by a bullet, any one can tell?

[Tecibbar]

I think arrow is much easier to deflect than a rock. An arrow is pretty long, touching any part of it will cause it to change direction or lose momentum. Also, when the arrow reaches you, it won't be lighting speed.

Dodging arrows is probably not a good idea, as you might run into your commrade's spear or stomp on someone, or the least creates chaos and demoralizes your army.

One can dodge bullets too you know, just move before the gun points at you.

[Taran ap Dafydd]

Missile weapons are the original inspiration for the shield.
Just wanted to toss that out there.

[Freddy1]

Missile weapons are the original inspiration for the shield.
Just wanted to toss that out there.

How about defense agaisnt the hand held spear attack?

[ahkong]

Has anyone ever thought of using the bodies of your dead enemies as shields?

the bodies is too heavy dude... LOL

[Lacrymosa]

the bodies is too heavy dude... LOL

Just crawl under the corpse and feign dead. That's what I will do in war. And I will be the one who tell other people how I blocked arrows with my bare hands and slain thousands of people and then escaped. lol

[ghostexorcist]

How about defense agaisnt the hand held spear attack?

In martial arts, there is a training set known as spear vs. sword and shield. I'm sure this has military applications. A person can both defend with the shield (i.e. bat it away) and attack with the sword.

[Lu Su]

Possible, yes. Of course. Anything can happen in war.

Is it likely???? No. =P I have to concur. However, this once again depends on a number of variables.

In Hwarang-Do, which I have studied (An ancient Korean martial art system, comparable to how Bushido was for the Samurai) 'Hwarang Warriors' are taught advanced weight and proximity air manipulation as a core foundation of the central styles. Using incoming weight against the opponent, be it weapon or fist (or something else) and fast torso strokes to move the air close to them or 'cut it'. Anyone can do this with enough practice and mental concentration. This is likely where the Korean legends originate since it could easily send an arrow off its course by a few millimeters to a few inches or deflect with the right gear. Obviously, this isn't substantial, but it can very easily mean the difference between life and death.

Based on my own studies of this and evidence by numerous masters, (just check you tube besides scholarly sources) YES, it is possible.

But, it is important to note that most of these stunts were performed in controlled environments, and in such, one can likely prepare for much because it is not in the heat of the moment, and typically is only one projectile, vs. many in a battlefield where the senses are tuned but demanded upon far more. Besides, how fast or hard are the arrows coming at you? At what angle? From how far of a distance? All important considerations to get the physics of deflection or dodge correct, and likely only with milliseconds to do so in a real battle.
notably
Possible, yes, certainly. But one cannot debate the fact that its likelihood for success, even by incredibly skilled warriors, is rather low. It really bares testament to the ancients bravery, and raises question as to how they may have dealt with arrows if without shields. (Besides the option of dying, of course =P )

[ghostexorcist]

In Hwarang-Do, which I have studied (An ancient Korean martial art system, comparable to how Bushido was for the Samurai) ...

This is a tad bit off topic.

Why is it that everyone else just happens to live next to a Dai Family Xinyi master or something similar, while, no matter where I move, there is always some crappy McDojo down the street?

I have read about the style before. Where on earth did you find a place that teaches that?

Edited by ghostexorcist, 03 May 2010 - 04:15 PM.

[kiwimeetskiwi]

survive, but it can still take you outta the fight. The obvious benefit is being able to fight another day (or if you're the soldier, not dying!). It'd also allow for more experienced soldiers and commanders to be running about.
I guess if a hail of arrows is coming at you, and you've got nothing but a sword, at the very least, one would try to deflect it, 'cause there's nothing else to do.

I would say it's an act of desperation, not to be relied on.

On silk underarmor, when did it come around? how common was it? (whole armies? or just elites/commanders in silk?)

Quite uncommon. It was usually only worn by officials.
http://www.chinahist...-as-protection/

[Lu Su]

This is a tad bit off topic.

Why is it that everyone else just happens to live next to a Dai Family Xinyi master or something similar, while, no matter where I move, there is always some crappy McDojo down the street?

I have read about the style before. Where on earth did you find a place that teaches that?

XD I got lucky, I suppose. US Hapkido Assocaiation. I studied under Grand Master Marshall Gagne, who has one Michigan dojo. The former one was located much closer to my old residence. The new one is slightly more northern in the state.