26 replies to this topic

[Liu]

Hi all,

I'm glad to suggest the 14th weekly poem translation.
I've chosen a poem from a Woman Poet of the Song Dynasty : 李清照 - Li Qingzhao (1084-1155)



Traditional characters:

聲聲慢

尋尋覓覓
冷冷清清
淒淒慘慘戚戚
乍暖還寒時候
最難將息
三杯兩盞淡酒
怎敵他晚來風急
雁過也
正傷心
卻是舊時相識
滿地黃花堆積
憔悴損
如今有誰堪摘
守著窗兒
獨自怎生得黑
梧桐更兼細雨
到黃昏點點滴滴
這次第
怎一個愁字了得

Simplified Charecters:

声声慢

寻寻觅觅，
冷冷清清，
凄凄惨惨戚戚。
乍暖还寒时候，
最难将息。
三杯两盏淡酒，
怎敌他、晚来风急？
雁过也，
正伤心，
却是旧时相识。

满地黄花堆积。
憔悴损，
如今有谁堪摘？
守著窗儿，
独自怎生得黑？
梧桐更兼细雨，
到黄昏、点点滴滴。
这次第，
怎一个、愁字了得！

Pinyin:

shēng shēng màn

xún xúnmì mì ，
lěnglěng qīng qīng ，
qīqī cǎn cǎn qīqī 。
zhà nuǎn hái hán shíhou ，
zuì nán jiāng xī 。
sān bēi liǎng zhǎn dàn jiǔ ，
zěn dí tā 、wǎn lái fēng jí ？
yàn guò yě ，
zhēng shāngxīn ，
quèshì jiùshí xiāngshí 。
mǎn Dìhuáng huā duījī 。
qiáocuì sǔn ，
rújīn yǒu shéi kān zhāi ？
shǒu zhāo chuāng ér ，
dúzì zěn shēng dé hēi ？
wútóng gēng jiān xìyǔ ，
dào huánghūn 、diǎndiǎndīdī 。
zhècì dì ，
zěn yīge 、chóu zì le dé ！



See you on Friday !!

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Reminder of the Basic Guidelines :

(1) *Everyone* is welcome to join in! You are especially welcome if this will be your first time doing this.
(2) Please wait until this Friday (Greenwich Mean Time) to post your translation.
(3) Kindly see François's earlier post regarding feedback:
The rules are pretty simple:
1- No posting of translation before Friday
2- This is not a contest, there is no reward or price. It is just for the fun of learning
3- Beginners are welcome, if this thread can help people realise that it is not *that* difficult, and that nice translations can be made by beginners in Chinese (or in English), it will be a success
4- Consequently, no criticising of others' attempts, no jury, no teacher, no correction. Highbrow, or disparaging comments (esp from people who don't translate) are discouraged
5- Translations must be yours. As most of the poems are famous, you can easilly find translations on the internet or at the library, we don't want those…
6- If you feel that you can't, if you feel embarrassed, don't ! We've all been there ! (and don't listen to people saying you need so many years of practice before you can even dare look at those poems... this is ridiculous)
7- There is no policy, and no criteria on what constitute a good or bad translation, you can try to be close to the chinese original, or "interpret it" as you see fit, you can try to make it rhyme, or not. In fact, the most interesting part is to see how different, yet faithful in different ways, some attempts may be.

[sylvester]

i like this poem and the poet!
i cant reacll where, but i am sure this poem had been translated, or seriously discussed before in this forum.
if not too many people realize this... than we can have a try~

[Tang Scholar]

There is a pretty good video on this poem by a university lecturer. The poem is read by him almost a minute after the start (0:54-1:58) and again by someone else at the end, in a beautiful animation . Pity I do not understand Chinese yet. But it is good to hear the poem in its original language.
See

[sylvester]

it sounds better in cantonese just like most of poems do.

i shell give the trandition chinese to you below.

李清照：聲聲慢
尋尋覓覓　冷冷清清　淒淒慘慘戚戚
乍暖還寒時候　最難將息
三杯兩盞淡酒　怎敵他晚來風急
雁過也　正傷心　卻是舊時相識
滿地黃花堆積
憔悴損　如今有誰堪摘
守著窗兒　獨個怎生得黑
梧桐更兼細雨
到黃昏　點點滴滴
這次第
怎一個愁字了得

Edited by sylvester, 09 November 2008 - 09:10 PM.

[Tang Scholar]

On the tree mentioned at the end of the poem. It has large leaves. Rain must sound a lot on it.

http://en.wikipedia....irmiana_simplex

There is a better photo, more fitting with the poem, at

http://outdoors.webs...053985734jYPOky

[sylvester]

On the tree mentioned at the end of the poem. It has large leaves. Rain must sound a lot on it.

http://en.wikipedia....irmiana_simplex

There is a better photo, more fitting with the poem, at

http://outdoors.webs...053985734jYPOky

thats a similar one, but that was NOT the 梧桐.
for real picture for 梧桐, see here :
http://www.hktree.co...ana simplex.htm
http://www.hktree.co...na simplex2.htm

[Tang Scholar]

Posted on Friday, 2:01 am GMT
Sylvester helped me to understand the poem.


Li Qingzhao


To a slow, slow tune


ask, ask –
seek, seek –.
cold, cold –
pure, pure.
Frost, frost– hurt, hurt–
pain, pain.

Sudden warmth
Cold returns
The hardest is
to have a rest.

How could a pair
or even three cups
of any warm wine
be match for the cold wind
coming at midnight?

Old time friend of mine,
a wild goose passes by
breaking my heart.

Withered chrisantemums
pile up on the land.
Who would care to pick up
flowers like these?

Alone at the window,
how to be able
to endure until dark?

On the great leaves
of the phoenix tree,
a soft drizzle is falling.

Sadness—Then how
a single word
could be enough?




Con muy lenta melodía


Busco, indago
busco, indago
Frío, frío—
puro, puro.
Hielo, hielo— duele, duele
pena, pena.

Calor de repente
El frío regresa
Lograr un descanso
es lo más difícil

Cómo puede un par
o incluso tres copas
de cálido vino
paliar el viento frío
que a media noche llega?

Pasa un ganso salvaje,
un amigo de antaño—
y el pecho se quiebra.

Crisantemos marchitos
se apilan en tierra.
¿A quién le provoca
alzar esas flores?

Junto a la ventana,
¿cómo hasta la noche
resistir tan sola?

Cae la llovizna
golpeando las hojas
de la firmiana.

Tristeza— apenas
una palabra,
¿acaso basta?

[sylvester]

at the +0800 time zone, it is firday already, my translation below~


a long melody of reduplication using, by Lei Cing Ziu

seaching and seaching, finding and finding,
still and quite, sorrowful, pitiful and depressed.
the day cold and warm alternate, is diffcult to let youself safely rest.
how could two or three cups of wine help to resist those strong wind at night?

goose pass by, i am hurt by, the one who know me long long time ago.
those chrysanthemum falls a layer on ground.
wan and sorrow, thin and pallid as been hurt.
who willing to pick them now?

staying by the windows, how could the day time be spend alone?
parasol tree in sight, and drizzle furthermore.
sunset finally, rain falls on the parasol leafs, a drop and a drop, a drop by a drop.
by this scene,
how a word "blues" could tell it over.

Edited by sylvester, 13 November 2008 - 09:49 PM.

[Tang Scholar]

thats a similar one, but that was NOT the 梧桐.
for real picture for 梧桐, see here :
http://www.hktree.co...ana simplex.htm
http://www.hktree.co...na simplex2.htm

Thank you for those pictures so clear, Sylvester.
They all look as the same tree to me, from the shape of their leaves (large and trilobulated, very much like those of the European platanus tree) and their flowers. The photo of the Wiki article is very clear. If you enlarge it, you will find a bunch of flowers near the top, to the left, in the same shape of the flowers of the trees on the pages you sent. The shape of the leaves can be better seen on the lower part of the tree.

The other photo I sent is not so good, but it shows the same type of leaves. There is a cypress in the background. But the humidity of the environment reminds me of the rain falling on those big leaves.

[sylvester]

the picture in wiki is correct, while another link is wrong
notes that 梧桐 leaf split into 3 clove each leaf, while the leaf in another link have split to 5 clove...
forgive me i dont know what the proper noun of plant in english... but you see carefully, then you will found they are not the same,
the one i sent and in wiki is 梧桐 but in the other link you gave is not.

[Tang Scholar]

the picture in wiki is correct, while another link is wrong
notes that 梧桐 leaf split into 3 clove each leaf, while the leaf in another link have split to 5 clove...
forgive me i dont know what the proper noun of plant in english... but you see carefully, then you will found they are not the same,
the one i sent and in wiki is 梧桐 but in the other link you gave is not.

Well....I will look at it tomorrow. I'm too tired now.

[Liu]

Here's my modest contribution in french.
It was too late yesterday evening to translate it in english... I'll make it by the end of the day.

声声慢
hēng shēng màn
son, bruit, voix, ton /lentement
Murmures

寻寻觅觅，
xún xúnmì mì
chercher, être à la recherche de, chercher
Je n’ai de cesse de chercher,

冷冷清清，
lěnglěng qīng qīng
froid, glacial, désert, silencieux/ clair,pur, distinct, net
dans le froid pur et glacial

凄凄惨惨戚戚。
qīqī cǎn cǎn qīqī
triste, solitaire/ lugubre, tragique, poignant, déchirant/parent, malheur
triste et solitaire

乍暖还寒时候，
zhà nuǎn hái hán shíhou
à peine, tout à l’heure – soudain, subitement/chaux, doux, chauffer/encore, aussi, assez, passablement/froid,pauvre /temps, moment
à l’instant cette chaleur, maintenant cette froideur

最难将息。
zuì nán jiāng xī
le plus / difficile, dur, désagréable /se reposer, récupérer ses forces
Comme il est difficile de trouver le repos

三杯两盏淡酒，
sān bēi liǎng zhǎn dàn jiǔ
trois verres deux coupes, godets / faible, léger, clair/alcool, eau-de-vie, vin
deux puis trois verres de vin doux

怎敌他、晚来风急？
zěn dí tā 、wǎn lái fēng jí ?
comment / ennemi- s’opposer à , résister à /lui / soir, nuit, tard / venir, arriver, prochain, suivant, environ/ vent / impatient, pressé, rapide, violent ?
Comment y résister, ce soir le vent souffle

雁过也,
yàn guò yě
oie sauvage, passer traverser, aussi
Les oies sauvages passent

正伤心，
zhēng shāngxīn
nouveau/ triste, affligé
et m’attristent un peu plus

却是旧时相识。
quèshì jiùshí xiāngshí
mais, cependant/ être/ vieux, ancien, usé / temps, heure, occasion, actuel, courant / se connaître
Je suis vieux, il est trop tard pour savoir

满地黄花堆积。
mǎn Dìhuáng huā duījī
plein, rempli, satisfait, suffisant / terre, région,lieu, distance/jaune / fleur, dessin, multicolore, brouillé / entasser, amonceler
Cet endroit tapissé de fleurs jaunes

憔悴损，
qiáocuì sǔn
défait, fâné / perdre, diminuer, nuire à
fânées n’est plus

如今有谁堪摘？
rújīn yǒu shéi kān zhāi ？
maintenant, aujourd’hui, à présent / avoir, il y a / qui /embarrassé, gêné ? / vieillir, arracher, choisir
Désormais, qui s’en soucie ?

守著窗儿，
shǒu zhāo chuāng ér ，
garder, observer, être proche /atteindre, brûler / fenêtre
Je reste près de cette fenêtre

独自怎生得黑？
dúzì zěn shēng dé hēi ？
seul, par soi-même/ comment / vivre, naître / acquérir, gagner, être fin, être prêt/ noir, sombre, secret
Comment vivre seul dans la mélancolie ?

梧桐更兼细雨，
wútóng gēng jiān xìyǔ ，
sterculia ? platane ?/changer, modifier / double, en même temps /mince, fin, minutieusement / pluie, pleuvoir
La bruine fine caresse les platanes

到黄昏、点点滴滴。
dào huánghūn 、diǎndiǎndīdī 。
arriver, parvenir, aller à /crépuscule /un petit peu / goutter,goutte
Dans le crépuscule, quelques gouttes de pluie

这次第，
zhècì dì ，
cette fois, présent/premier ???
Ainsi

怎一个、愁字了得！
zěn yīge 、chóu zì le dé ！
comment un / se tourmenter, être triste, mélancolique /caractère, mot / acquérir, gagner, être prêt
pourquoi se tourmenter à trouver les mots

--------English version---------

Murmurings

I’m still looking without respite,
In the pure and icy cold,
Sad and solitary.
At the moment this heat, now this coolness,
How difficult it is to find some rest.
Two then three glasses of sweet wine,
How to resist ? This evening the wind blows,
The wild gooses pass,
and sadden me a little more.
I’m old, it’s too late to know.
This place covered with faded yellow flowers,
doesn’t exist anymore.
But now, who cares?
Alone at the window,
How to live alone in the melancholy?
The fine drizzle caresses the plane trees,
In the dusk, some rainy drops
Why should I worry to find the words ?

Edited by Liu, 14 November 2008 - 01:49 PM.

[Yizheng]

Well, it is melancholy twilight here in Moscow, no Chinese trees out my window, just the Russian birch. Here is my translation of this poem.

I'm seeking, searching, looking,
So desolate and chill,
So mournful, filled with woe.
Now warmth, now cold in sudden change,
Hardest just to draw my breath.
How can a few cups of weak wine
Fend off the night wind come swift?
Wild goose passes by above,
And my heart swells with hurt
Old echo of he I once knew.
Chrysanthemums fallen thick on the ground,
They lie faded and bruised,
And who shall come gather them now?
Alone here at the window,
How to hold on as day creeps by?
Parasol tree wears a shroud of fine rain,
Endless drizzle on and on into the dusk.
One drop after another,
What word could I take from their saddened stream.

[Tang Scholar]

Well....I will look at it tomorrow. I'm too tired now.

Well - First the name of the tree. Scientific name: it has two names. One is Firmiana simplex. The other one is Sterculia platanifolia. Until now I have not been able to find an English name for this tree. In Spanish it is called "Parasol chino", Chinese parasol. I would prefer phoenix tree...

There is a page in Spanish with beautiful photos and all the botanical details. It is:
http://fichas.infoja...china-chino.htm

In English there is also a very good description at

http://www.efloras.o...on_id=242322646
From there I copy:
Description from Flora of China

Hibiscus simplex Linnaeus, Sp. Pl., ed. 2, 2: 977. 1763; Firmiana platanifolia (Linnaeus f.) Schott & Endlicher; F. simplex var. glabra Hatusima; Sterculia firmiana J. F. Gmelin; S. platanifolia Linnaeus f.; S. pyriformis Bunge; S. simplex (Linnaeus) Druce.

Deciduous trees, up to 16 m tall; bark greenish, smooth. Petiole 15-30 cm; leaf blade cordate, palmately 3-5-lobed, 15-30 cm in diam., lobes triangular, both surfaces glabrous or minutely puberulent, basal veins 7, base cordate, apex acuminate. Inflorescence paniculate, terminal, 20-50 cm. Calyx yellowish green, 7-9 mm, divided nearly to base, lobes linear, twisted outward, abaxially puberulent and yellowish, adaxially villous only basally; pedicel nearly as long as calyx. Male flower: androgynophore as long as calyx, thicker in lower part, glabrous. Anthers 15, irregularly fascicled, pistillode pear-shaped and very small. Female flower: ovary globose, hairy. Follicle membranous, stalked, foliaceous, 6-11 × 1.5-2.5 cm, 2-4-seeded, abaxially puberulent or nearly glabrous. Seeds globose, ca. 7 mm in diam., wrinkled. Fl. Jun. 2n = 40*.

Widely cultivated. Anhui, Fujian, Guangdong, Guangxi, Guizhou, Hainan, Hubei, Hunan, Jiangsu, Jiangxi, Shaanxi, Shandong, Shanxi, Sichuan, Taiwan, Yunnan, Zhejiang [Japan; cultivated in Europe and North America (United States)].
[Quotation ended]
See that the leaf is "palmately 3-5-lobed" according to this page.
Oh, what a lot of strange terminology.

But one thing is certain. We are seeing in those pictures the tree she talks about!

[Yun]

寻寻觅觅，
冷冷清清，
凄凄惨惨戚戚。
乍暖还寒时候，
最难将息。
三杯两盏淡酒，
怎敌他、晚来风急？
雁过也，
正伤心，
却是旧时相识。

Seeking lost memories,
I'm lonely and cold
And heavy with woe.
Warm one moment and chilly the next,
I try to sleep but fail.
Two or three cups of water-like wine -
What use in an evening gale?
A wild goose heads south in the sky above
And the sight just breaks my heart
- For isn't this he who once carried a letter
To the man whom I lost but still love?

满地黄花堆积。
憔悴损，
如今有谁堪摘？
守著窗儿，
独自怎生得黑？
梧桐更兼细雨，
到黄昏、点点滴滴。
这次第，
怎一个、愁字了得！

Yellow chrysanthemums litter the ground -
Old, withered, and worn,
Who would pick them now?
I sit by the window, all forlorn;
How long 'till the sun goes down?
At dusk, rain falls on the parasol tree
Then drizzles and drips from each leaf.
How could one word like 'sorrow' express
All this hopelessness and grief?