162 replies to this topic

[Gubook Janggoon]

If the korean contains about 50% chinese, what is the other 50% ...???

Korean?

BTW..I don't know jack about the Qin/Jinhan connection..so ya'll have fun.

[chan4059]

Korean?

BTW..I don't know jack about the Qin/Jinhan connection..so ya'll have fun.

I want to know the specific words that were borrowed from the Hans, can u give me an example...

[tianzhuwoye]

If the korean contains about 50% chinese, what is the other 50% ...???

Most of the other 50% is usually referred to as 'Native Korean,' but where it comes from exactly is currently the subject of some vicious debate.

And I'm almost positive that the solidification of the difference between 邦 and 国 was in fact introduced after 邦 became taboo, so 5 points for the nationalist movement, I guess. 대한민국!! (clap clap clap clap clap)

[Gubook Janggoon]

Take my name.

Gubooki (Shortened to Gubook) is a native Korean word for turtle, whereas Janggoon is a loan word meaning general.

The loan word for turtle would be "Gui"...sound familiar?

[chan4059]

Most of the other 50% is usually referred to as 'Native Korean,' but where it comes from exactly is currently the subject of some vicious debate.

so the believe that the 'native korean' is derived from another language?>

[chan4059]

Take my name.

Gubooki (Shortened to Gubook) is a native Korean word for turtle, whereas Janggoon is a loan word meaning general.

The loan word for turtle would be "Gui"...sound familiar?

are u chinese and korean so much knowledge....?

[Gubook Janggoon]

are u chinese and korean so much knowledge....?

I'm flattered..I'm actually quite stupid.

I'm Korean.

대한민국!! (clap clap clap clap clap)

오!~ 필승 코리아!~

[tianzhuwoye]

so the believe that the 'native korean' is derived from another language?>

Like all modern languages it had to come from somewhere. But the big issue is what other languages it's 'related' to, and to address your original question, the family that includes the Chineses has been pretty much ruled out.

As far as examples, as Gubook Janggoon has said, there's just too **** many of them. If you've seen written Japanese, it would be a 'similar' situation except that Korean by now has chosen to write all vocabulary items in a single alphabet. But you're right, the pronunciation of the borrowed vocabulary sounds distinctly 'southern'- with the understanding being that most of these words got to the peninsula during the Tang Empire.

[chan4059]

Like all modern languages it had to come from somewhere. But the big issue is what other languages it's 'related' to, and to address your original question, the family that includes the Chineses has been pretty much ruled out.

As far as examples, as Gubook Janggoon has said, there's just too **** many of them. If you've seen written Japanese, it would be a 'similar' situation except that Korean by now has chosen to write all vocabulary items in a single alphabet. But you're right, the pronunciation of the borrowed vocabulary sounds distinctly 'southern'- with the understanding being that most of these words got to the peninsula during the Tang Empire.

The Tang Dynasty, I mean should it be earlier like Han dynasty... I wonder if Han and Tang Dynasty speak the same dialect...?

[Gubook Janggoon]

I split the question about the origins of the Li family and sent it to the Tang forum.

You can find it here.

http://www.chinahist...6

[Yun: And I closed it because I have supplied a link there to a thread we already have on this issue. It should answer all your questions.]

[Yun]

And I'm almost positive that the solidification of the difference between 邦 and 国 was in fact introduced after 邦 became taboo, so 5 points for the nationalist movement, I guess. 대한민국!! (clap clap clap clap clap)

Excellent deduction, I was still trying to draw the connection myself! The word 邦 did become taboo in the Han because of Liu Bang.

But what has it to do with Korean nationalism?

[Liang Jieming]

Cantonese is fairly close to the dialect spoken during the Tang. I suppose if the heavy borrowing of Chinese words occured during the Tang and survived to this day, then they would share many sounds and words in common with today's cantonese.

BTW, Gubook, your name means General Turtle? hehehehe that's pretty neat! Kinda like TMNT! Which one are you?

[chan4059]

Are Korean mixed with Hans too... or no??

[chan4059]

Is there any way to tell how much Han you are mixed with? and how much you are not by looking at the face?

[tianzhuwoye]

But what has it to do with Korean nationalism? 

Probably nothing- I was just being a j***. Question would be at what point and why the new convention made it to the peninsula- picking up the distinction at a later date would call the extent of the Han Empire's influence on the area into question- while the 'irony' of it all is 대한민국 is just 大韩民-you guessed it- 国.
('daehan min'guk' for the pronunciation connection down south)

also-

I've heard that the "f" sound is nonexistent in Han dynasty Chinese, and voila, the sound is also absent in modern Korean. I'm guessing the Koreans actually kept this feature that is lost among the Chinese

The thing with this fricative 'f' sound is that as far as I know (not far) it and a lot of other similar sounds up by the teeth and lips (like the readings of English 'th') feels relatively rare worldwide. I'm having a hard time juggling all the timeframes and possible influences but my understanding is that 'f' as well as its voiced partner 'v' actually did exist at some point in real old spoken Chinese. Right now it's either coming or going, since the 'v' isn't currently available and these things tend to come in pairs. Is there something like that still (?) going on in the Shanghai area? How do you read 口+伐? Nishishei is our resident hero in this regard and maybe he or somebody else will swing by for clarification.