25 replies to this topic

[Grigori]

Then what were the Japanese good at during WWII?  Just the Mitsubishi Zeroshiki?

And what were the Chinese good at?

The Japanese were not as advanced as the western world, they chose to focus on aircraft and the navy rather than tanks. They had a superb navy, though it couldn't come close to the rate of buildup the USN did during the war. Their aircraft was quite good at the beginning of the war but these were soon eclipsed by superior and more numerous planes. The Japanese army was the worest. They had dedicated people but their equipment from tanks to guns were universally c**p.

China imported or license produced all its weapons. There were no major weapons of indigenous design. Not even a lousy submachine gun. We had no real navy, the airforce was ineffective and the ground forces were disorganized and poorly trained. There were some very good small unit infantry on both the KMT and CCP side but these weren't enough to win big battles. What was needed was for the KMT and CCP to have a coherent grand strategy and use coordinated, aggressive counter-attacks instead of the containment actions in the south and harassment actions up north.

If the Soviet Union seriously supplied Mao with arms he could also breakout east across north China. Japanese occupation zones would be cut in two and supplies from southeast Asia to Japan would be interrupted. The Japanese weren't really strong on the ground. Just that China was extremely weak.

[Daniel]

Japanese tanks during WWII were c**p. They were essentially light tanks comparable to European light tanks of the mid thirties. Heck I think if China had a few battalions of French S35s they could've won the Battle of Shanghai.

Absolutely, even a non-contender like the American M3 Stuart could and did beat Japanese tanks in island warfare.

Then what were the Japanese good at during WWII? Just the Mitsubishi Zeroshiki?

Grigori hit the highlights. The Zero was a fine design for the start of the war, but the Japanese didn't improve it, so it soon found itself outclassed by other planes with better pilot protection and self-sealing fuel tanks.

As for the Japanese army, I would say that its training and low-level leadership were pretty darn good, looking at what it did to the U.S. in the Philippines and Britain in Singapore in the face of far superior numbers. About equipment, I don't know much. Was the Nambu machine gun c**p too, Grigori? But one thing that almost all Allied commanders agreed on was that the Japanese army was masterful at concealment and camouflage.

[lobster]

But one thing that almost all Allied commanders agreed on was that the Japanese army was masterful at concealment and camouflage.

Wouldn't that be the CCP guerillas?

What about China, we couldn't be all c**p?

[yehzhaofeng]

You have to also know that the Japanese did not really control the areas shown on an, Occupation of China map. The Japanese simply controlled the railways and roads. Constant harrasment within the railroad pockets drove the japanese nuts as day by day, railroads were cut off in sabotages, japanese units keep disapearing. Once they go out to investigate, nothing but peasants working in on farms, or just looking as if nothing happened.

Besides, most of the armer vehicles were foreign which had been captured by the Communist Guerillas, even then, they did not use them to their max.

[Liang Jieming]

You guys should read this book.

"The Jungle is Neutral" by Spencer Chapman

His account of the Japanese invasion of Malaya and the subsequent occupation years living with the Chinese guerillas in the jungles is very insightful. The Japanese were short of equipment most of the time and full of non-standard equipment and uniforms. They captured weapons as part of their invasion policy.

Incidently, Chapman is full of praise for the Chinese in his book, something one doesn't read in many history books published in SEA.

[Yun]

The Japanese were not as advanced as the western world, they chose to focus on aircraft and the navy rather than tanks. They had a superb navy, though it couldn't come close to the rate of buildup the USN did during the war. Their aircraft was quite good at the beginning of the war but these were soon eclipsed by superior and more numerous planes.

The Japanese did continue to design good fighter models after the Mitsubishi A6M1 (Zero), right up to the end of the war. These included some jet-propelled types. However, their industrial capacity was inadequate to produce enough numbers to make a difference, and some of the best designs never made it past prototype stage.

[lobster]

The Japanese did continue to design good fighter models after the Mitsubishi A6M1 (Zero), right up to the end of the war. These included some jet-propelled types. However, their industrial capacity was inadequate to produce enough numbers to make a difference, and some of the best designs never made it past prototype stage.

Gundam.... this is Gundam 0079!

Sieg Zeon!

[Daniel]

Wouldn't that be the CCP guerillas? 

What about China, we couldn't be all c**p?

I'm sorry, I have to plead my own ignorance. I can recall absolutely nothing about Chinese equipment in WW2.

The only thing I can remember from my WW2 studies on the Chinese army is the observation of an American officer (I think it was Stilwell, but I'm not sure), on the Guomindang army. He said that the Guomindang Chinese soldiers were extremely brave and had high morale, but they were appallingly led by their officers. As an example of the latter, he mentioned a Chinese army commander who withdrew his artillery out of range of the coming battle, as it was more important to him to ensure that his army remained the only Guomindang army equipped with heavy guns than to actually use those guns to support his men.

[Alexander39]

I'm sorry, I have to plead my own ignorance.  I can recall absolutely nothing about Chinese equipment in WW2.

German helmets and french (light)machine guns + the common Maxim machine guns among the light weapons.
French 75mm WW1 field cannons, and 47mm mountain guns, were all made by the various arsenals/factories & workshops.
The KMT had more than 4 different calibers for it's rifles alone. 7.5mm. 7.62mm. 7.7mm and some italian 6.5mm. and several off them in various sizes so the they could not be used in rifles of another manufacturer not all 7.62mm rifle cartidges were interchangable fks.

The only thing I can remember from my WW2 studies on the Chinese army is the observation of an American officer (I think it was Stilwell, but I'm not sure), on the Guomindang army.  He said that the Guomindang Chinese soldiers were extremely brave and had high morale, but they were appallingly led by their officers.  As an example of the latter, he mentioned a Chinese army commander who withdrew his artillery out of range of the coming battle, as it was more important to him to ensure that his army remained the only Guomindang army equipped with heavy guns than to actually use those guns to support his men.

That same General would have been

A ) Executet in the. Japanese, German & Soviet, Armies

B ) Courtmartialed and maybe executet in French, Italian, Polish & Spanish armies.

C ) Courtmartialed in British, American & commenwealth armies whit a risk for serious jailtime under hard labor!

[Daniel]

French 75mm WW1 field cannons, and 47mm mountain guns, were all made by the various arsenals/factories & workshops.

Really? I always hear very good things said about the French 75mm. Reportedly it was reliable and had a good carriage, so that it could be fired repeatedly without much re-laying.

[Grigori]

As for the Japanese army, I would say that its training and low-level leadership were pretty darn good, looking at what it did to the U.S. in the Philippines and Britain in Singapore in the face of far superior numbers.  About equipment, I don't know much.  Was the Nambu machine gun c**p too, Grigori?  But one thing that almost all Allied commanders agreed on was that the Japanese army was masterful at concealment and camouflage.

The Japanese success at Singapore was largely owed to the poor leadership of the British commander Arthur Percival as well as the excellent Japanese general Tomoyuki Yamashita, whose invasion of Malaysia and Singapore were textbook perfect. He was probably the best Japanese general. Tojo became jealous of his success and sidelined him for the remainder of the war.

Nambu invented many weapons and machine guns. Almost all of his designs were seriously flawed. Japanese machine guns often ran on different ammo than that issued to the riflemen. They had no belt-fed machine guns and their ammo required oiling before fire. Japanese machine guns and rifles also fired not so powerful rounds which they tried to replace mid-war, unsuccessfully. Their only good machine gun was the Type-99 LMG, but this was rather late in the war and not enough were produced.

One area they were particularly bad at was the submachine gun. By 1941 most armies wised up to making cheap stamped SMGs by the millions. The Japanese only made an old generation milled SMG which was costly and only made in limited numbers. Ironically, nobody needed SMGs as bad as the Japanese troops fighting in the jungles.

Another weapon they lacked sorely was a decent portable anti-tank weapon. They didn't have anything like a Bazooka or Panzerfaust. Their idea of an anti-tank weapon was a guy sitting in a hole with an aerial bomb between his knees. He waited for a tank to pass over him and hit the fuse with a rock. They were completely unable to fight armored battles on open terrain. Which is why the Soviets rolled them over in 1939 and in 1945. The Japanese had a reputation for tenacity holed up on islands. But everytime they fought a mobile armor foe they ran like rabbits.