29 replies to this topic

[Shiang]

sumerian is a language isolate, unrelated to all other languages on earth.

[baybal]

http://storm.ca/~cm-...r_turk1of5.html

[Jeff_R]

here is a list with the only sumerian words i know:

lugal = king
nin = queen
dumu = child
amar = calf
ses = brother
dingir = god
do you know more? i would like to know what "butterfly" is in sumerian language.

here is some grammar i know:

sumerian is using principle of aglutination,
it uses ergativity, so it marks nouns which act and which are acted on,
it uses particles bound to the verb to cross-reference each case for each noun used in the sentence.


some examples:

posession 1:
A B.ak means B is owner of A ( the point is just a convention to differentiate the agglutinated particles)
A B C.ak.ak means C is the owner of B which is the owner of A

ses lugal.ak = the brother of the king
dumu ses lugal.ak.ak = the child of the brother of the kind

posession 2:

lugal = king but lugal.zu = your king, lugal.gu = my king, lugal.ani= his king

plural:

lugal=king but lugal.ene = kings

dumu.ene= children
nin.ene=queens
amar.ene = calves
.
.
.
combination of particles:

lugal = king
lugal.zu = your king
lugal.zu.ene your kings

............................................

1.Does anybody know more to teach us?

2. which scholar came up with the idea of contact between hua-xia and sumerians?

[Jeff_R]

i forgot about :

e = house
egal = temple
dab = wall

[yunyun]

I've heard that the Sumerians are black people (African race?). I don't think Sumerian's skull shape is like Caucasoid people because it looks rounder. But I'm pretty sure they are not Semitic people.

[norenxaq]

inded, the Sumerians are not considered semitic. african, however depends on who one talks with. consensus is that they weren't

[Jeff_R]

i only know about the depiction and figurines of sumerian origins. figures are often portrayed with very big eyes, exaggerated big. but appart from this they look more like todays afghan and indian people http://farm6.static...._10753e2db6.jpg .

low forehad
long midface
big erragted nose
wavy hair

yet some look more between african and turkish

http://realhistoryww...Sumer/a_019.jpg


certainly not as attractive in features like the terracotta army, but maybe the sumerian figurines are not very realistic represantations.

one of my friends tries to convince me of their turkish descend, but i see no evidence so far

[kate123jackson]

I am so please someone is finally approaching this subject. Information on this topic is hard to come by. Your posts add to my theory that the Gutians who invaded the Babylonian Empire (supposedly from the Zagros mountains), were in fact, of ''Chinese'' origin. The language has been identified as similar to Tocharian, but, what is confusing historians , is that they are described in the Sumerian texts as a peolple fair in appearance. The Tarim Basin where the Tocharian language originates, borders (sure enough) with Mongolia to the East and the Middle East to the West.
Given that the original settlers on the Yellow River were emmigrants from Elam in the Middle East, is it possible that these people then migrated back to the East to Babylon where they interbred with it's women and founded the race of what we today know as Chinese? Thus Asian in appearance , but taller and darker than the Gutian invaders at Babylon?
Can anyone shed any light on this for me?
Hope I am being clear!!!

[somechineseperson]

'Caucasoid' can mean from the Caucasus Mountains, OR it can mean 'White'. It's a PC term, like 'African-American' for 'Black'. PC terms are not designed with convenience in mind, nor, usually, with accuracy. The Indo-Europeans are 'White', as are the Semites, (which race includes not only Jews, but Arabs, Assyrians, Pheonicians, Arameans and Amharic, [Etiopians]), and the Hamites, (Berbers, Egyptians, etc.).

The Sumerians' heads come closest to the 'Whites'', but are rounder. They may well be a transitional race, originating about the time of differentiation. Many of the statuary heads also portray the epicanthic fold of the 'Mongoloid', or 'Yellow' race(s), or whatever term one uses.

The ancient Mesopotamians did not have chariots. That was an inovation of the 'Aryans''. One of those attributed to them which they actually did develop. The chariot, introduced to Egypt by the 'Hyksos', is a reason why some think that the Hyksos had, at least some, Aryan components.

The Tocharians, (Yuëh Ji[sp.?]), were Aryan, and it has been suggested that they brought ancestor worship/veneration to China. I think that this last is too prevalent and wide-spread a phenomenon to say that the Indo-Europeans brought it/taught it to 'the Middle Kingdom'.

 

Tocharians may have introduced the chariot to China but ancestor worship was an universal religious practice in every human tribe and culture. To say that Indo-Europeans "taught" ancestor worship to the Chinese is really very ridiculous.

Edited by somechineseperson, 06 January 2013 - 03:58 PM.

[somechineseperson]

According to the mainstream view, there is no evidence of any direct contact between Chinese and Sumerians. There is also no evidence that early Chinese civilisation originated from West Asia. Historical and archaeological evidence generally suggests that early Chinese civilisation developed from indigenous neolithic sources, like the Longshan culture.

[somechineseperson]

Huangdi tribe is the ancestor of Han-Chinese and Huangdi came from the western.
According to ancient history book, the Huangdi (黃帝) tribe came from Mount Kunlun(昆侖). But today no one exactly know where the Mount Kunlun is. Some scholar believe, the Mount Kunlun lie in western asia. In western asia myth, we can find a famous mountain very similar with Kunlun. That mountain called Khursag Kurkura, means mountain of all land...

 

Actually everyone knows where Mount Kunlun is. It's the major mountain range between today's Xinjiang and Tibet.

 

Seriously, "Chinese civilisation originated from the West" type theories were a product of the colonial era, and have been subsequently discredited.

[Zhou-ist]

The only remote connection I can tell between the Huaxia and the Sumerians is that both referred to themselves as the 'black haired people' ... strange coincidence.

[somechineseperson]

Not a coincedence given both had black hair...that doesn't mean there was any direct contact though.

[Zhou-ist]

Not a coincedence given both had black hair...that doesn't mean there was any direct contact though.

 

Maybe you're right, but still ... 

 

We know that Sumeria had direct and fruitful contact with the Indus Valley civilization. We know that Indo-Europeans in the form of the Tocharians lived, traded and mingled right on the borders of historic China. No direct contact between the Mesopotamian and Yellow River valleys yes, but no contact at all ?? I don't think so. 

[mohistManiac]

I know people that have black dogs and cats.  Their hair is black.  So the dog and cat had contact? Hmmmm.