35 replies to this topic

[Kediren]

I've been meaning to find this out which one actually invented printing first and what is the difference between Gutenburgs and the Chinese ways?

Block printing, whereby individual sheets of paper were pressed into wooden blocks with the text and illustrations carved in, was first recorded in Chinese history, and was in use in East Asia long before Gutenberg. By the 12th and 13th century many Arabic and Chinese libraries contained tens of thousands of printed books. The Koreans and Chinese knew about movable metal types at the time, but arising from the complexity of the Chinese writing system, movable type printing wasn't as widely used as that of Renaissance Europe.

It is not clear whether Gutenberg knew of these existing techniques or invented them independently, though the former is considered unlikely because of the substantial differences in technique. Some also claim the Dutchman Laurens Coster as the first European to invent movable type.

Gutenberg certainly introduced efficient methods into book production, leading to a boom in the production of texts in Europe -- in large part, owing to the popularity of the Gutenberg Bibles, the first mass-produced work, starting on February 23, 1455. Even so, Gutenberg was a poor businessman, and made little money from his printing system.

Gutenberg began experimenting with metal typography after he had moved from his native town of Mainz to Strassburg (then in Germany, now Strasbourg, France) around 1430. Knowing that wood-block type involved a great deal of time and expense to reproduce, because it had to be hand carved, Gutenberg concluded that metal type could be reproduced much more quickly once a single mould had been fashioned. His initial efforts enabled him to mass-produce indulgences -- printed slips of paper sold by the Catholic Church to remit temporal punishments in purgatory for sins committed in this life, for those wealthy enough to afford indulgences. This, in part, led to Martin Luther's critical response to indulgences.

Although Gutenberg was financially unsuccessful in his lifetime, his invention spread quickly, and news and books began to travel across Europe much faster than before. It fed the growing Renaissance, and since it greatly facilitated scientific publishing, it was a major catalyst for the later scientific revolution. The ability to produce many copies of a new book, and the appearance of Greek and Latin works in printed form was a major factor in the Reformation. Literacy also increased dramatically as a result. Gutenberg's inventions are sometimes considered the turning point from the Mediaeval Era to the Early Modern Period.
The term incunabulum refers to any western printed book produced between the first work of Gutenberg and the end of the year 1500.

There are many statues of Gutenberg in Germany -- one of the more famous being a work by Thorvaldsen, in Mainz, home to the Gutenberg Museum.

The Gutenberg Galaxy and Project Gutenberg also commemorate Gutenberg's name.

http://en.wikipedia....ohann_Gutenberg

Edited by Kediren, 17 January 2006 - 06:36 PM.

[jwrevak]

I've been meaning to find this out which one actually invented printing first and what is the difference between Gutenburgs and the Chinese ways?

Chinese beat Gutenberg. Text printing was accomplished in China by the 8th century. Movable type, Gutenberg's major claim to fame, was accomplished in China by Pi Sheng by the 11th century, about four centuries before Gutenberg. However, most pre-modern printing in China was probably done with carved woodblocks rather than movable type due to the enormous number of characters required by the Chinese language.

[Kulong]

Chinese beat Gutenberg. Text printing was accomplished in China by the 8th century. Movable type, Gutenberg's major claim to fame, was accomplished in China by the 11th century, about four centuries before Gutenberg. However, most pre-modern printing in China was probably done with carved woodblocks rather than movable type due to the enormous number of characters required by the Chinese language.

Pardon my ignorance but how is movable type different from the "carved woodblocks"?

[l0ckx]

Pardon my ignorance but how is movable type different from the "carved woodblocks"?

from what i understand, woodblocks were solid blocks of carved wood. Moveable type was individual letters (or characters) carved out of pieces of wood, which could be arranged on a template. The individual characters could be reused over and over. on the other hand, woodblocks would only be good for printing of that specificly carved woodblock, you can't recarve it.

[Kulong]

from what i understand, woodblocks were solid blocks of carved wood. Moveable type was individual letters (or characters) carved out of pieces of wood, which could be arranged on a template. The individual characters could be reused over and over. on the other hand, woodblocks would only be good for printing of that specificly carved woodblock, you can't recarve it.

But in both systems, the individual unit is still a character/symbol carved on a block, right?

[DaMo]

But in both systems, the individual unit is still a character/symbol carved on a block, right?

But in movable type, you can reuse the characters for a different text, whereas in block type, the block contains the whole text and is usable for only that text.

[Kulong]

But in movable type, you can reuse the characters for a different text, whereas in block type, the block contains the whole text and is usable for only that text.

Ah gotcha...

So China never had movable type? I recall seeing images of old Chinese newspaper printshops where they had two large shelves with pre-carved character blocks and they placed each character block onto a row to print.

[Craig]

Chinese beat Gutenberg. Text printing was accomplished in China by the 8th century. Movable type, Gutenberg's major claim to fame, was accomplished in China by Pi Sheng by the 11th century, about four centuries before Gutenberg. However, most pre-modern printing in China was probably done with carved woodblocks rather than movable type due to the enormous number of characters required by the Chinese language.

Text printing was dated to 872 ad, and was a printed Lankavatara Sutra found at Dunhuang by Aurel Syein.

[DaMo]

So China never had movable type?

Oh, they had both block and movable. I was just pointing out the difference between the two.

[Alexander39]

It is probably the great numbers of Chinese characters that inhibitet the development of more advanced forms of printing involving metal among other things,and indirectly also new ideas.
While chinese characters is great for conserving knowledge throu the ages, they are lousy when it comes mass producktion techniques in a time when something new is developed continiusly fks a renassance, simply becourse it is so very difficult compared to romanized alphabets fks, to keep on developing something new in expression and typing.
Gutenbergs development indirectly insured European supremacy since ideas suddenly easily, fast and CHEAP could cross the various borders, to the benefit (And ruin) of many that would not have had that chance before.

Edited by Alexander39, 18 January 2006 - 02:58 AM.

[Kediren]

http://www.nb.no/baser/schoyen/5/5.18/ <-- WOW, Sumerian and Babilonians were first !

woodblock technic:



http://library.think...3062/print.html



http://www.travelchi...hou/0016847.htm



In ancient China, characters are carved on the bamboo sheets as books, so book may weight a lot.

http://rki.kbs.co.kr...story_con42.htm


The wooden blocks used to print the Tripitaka Koreana, carved between 1237 and 1252.

http://media.granite...ea/tripitak.htm <--

movable metal types technic:

<-- gutenberg technic..





http://www.uh.edu/engines/epi753.htm

Edited by Kediren, 18 January 2006 - 03:10 AM.

[DaMo]

http://www.nb.no/baser/schoyen/5/5.18/ <-- WOW, Sumerian and Babilonians were first !

If seals are considered "block printing", sure. In that case, the Chinese cultures had this technology since the Shang dynasty. So did the Egyptians and Central Asians, and probably a lot of other cultures.

[Kediren]

If seals are considered "block printing", sure. In that case, the Chinese cultures had this technology since the Shang dynasty. So did the Egyptians and Central Asians, and probably a lot of other cultures.

hmm.. i know that a oldes "block printing" was maked in stone age.. (Cylinder seals)



Jemdet Nasr (ca. 2,800 B.C.)





http://oi.uchicago.e...os/stamp_1.html <-- click on next image

http://en.wikipedia....i/Cylinder_seal

http://images.google...nG=Bilder-Suche

Edited by Kediren, 18 January 2006 - 06:32 AM.

[l0ckx]

It is probably the great numbers of Chinese characters that inhibitet the development of more advanced forms of printing involving metal among other things,and indirectly also new ideas.
While chinese characters is great for conserving knowledge throu the ages, they are lousy when it comes mass producktion techniques in a time when something new is developed continiusly fks a renassance, simply becourse it is so very difficult compared to romanized alphabets fks, to keep on developing something new in expression and typing.
Gutenbergs development indirectly insured European supremacy since ideas suddenly easily, fast and CHEAP could cross the various borders, to the benefit (And ruin) of many that would not have had that chance before.

what is fks?

Edited by l0ckx, 18 January 2006 - 11:51 AM.