[Peng]

Is "日本" actually made up by Empress Wu Zetian? I can't find any sources to support this claim. I only found this in http://www.uglychine...rg/japanese.htm

Quote

The Chinese TV drama depicted Tang Empress Wu Zetian as making up the name of 'Ri Ben' for the Japanese emissary. (I found an entry in history book supporting the Empress Wu Zetian claim.)

I don't know how accurate this is...

[Yun]

The dynastic histories say only that the Japanese chose the new name because they found 'Wonu' to be too insulting. Some scholars also doubt the credibility of this claim: they believe 'Wonu' was itself derived from a native Japanese term. That may be so, but the characters that the Chinese used to transliterate it (meaning 'dwarf slave') would still have been insulting to the Japanese.

In 608, the Japanese empress Suiko wrote a letter to Sui Yangdi referring to herself as "the Son of Heaven of the Land where the Sun Rises" and to her Sui counterpart as "the Son of Heaven of the Land where the Sun Sets". Yangdi was offended and sent an envoy to Japan to remind Suiko that she was a vassal of the Sui empire. So it seems that the Japanese perception of themselves as living in the "land of the origin of the sun" was already around at that time.

[Gubook Janggoon]

Bruce Cumings makes the claims that the term was probably invented by people living somewhere on the penninsula of Korea, but does little to back up the claim.

[Borjigin Ayurbarwada]

The first official enfeofment of title of the king of 日本 was during Tang Gao Zong, in the year 670 a.d.

[Yun]

I did recently read the argument that the Japanese title for their emperor, Tenno (Tianhuang), was derived from the titles of Tianhuang and Tianhuang-hou being used by Tang Gaozong and Empress Wu (i.e. Wu Zetian).

[Borjigin Ayurbarwada]

Wang Xiao Fu of the Bei Jing university found out that the name of Ni Bon was actually enfeoffed to Japan by Wu Ze Tian in the seventh mission in 701 AD, not the sixth mission in 669. The reason is that the Tong Dian recorded the date to be 701, while the version in Jiu Tang Shu was ambiguous. It stated that Japan came to the Tang court to congradulate the pacification of Koguryo in the sixth mission, and afterwards, empress Wu enfoeffed the title of Japan. Therefore, the date of the enfeoffment is most probably 701 AD and not 670 AD as traditionally thought.

The Tang didn't actually create the name for Japan. Japan proposed what it wanted to be called, and its up to Tang to grant that permission.

The international system of East Asia at that time was centered around the Tang court at Da Ming palace.(similar to the modern UN) States in the tributary system were either enfeoffed or renamed after they propose what they want to be referred as. When Kogryo wanted to be successor of Kogryo, it was accepted by the Chinese court, but when Vietnam wanted to be referred to as Nan Yue during the Qing, it was turned down. This enfeoffment doesn't change how these states called themselves, but in relationship to other states that were under the tributary system, they need the investiture of the Chinese court.

[Beccy]

what I want to know is how foreigners came up with words like "China" and "Japan" from "Zongguo" and "Nihon"

[天武桓皇]

Beccy, on Sep 21 2007, 10:19 AM, said:

what I want to know is how foreigners came up with words like "China" and "Japan" from "Zongguo" and "Nihon"

China: It probably came from the Qin Dynasty.


Japan: The Wu Chinese word for Nihon sounded something like "Zeppen" (modern Shanghainese still pronounces Nihon that way). It moved to Malaysia (the old Malay word for Japan was Jepang), and this Malay word was encountered by Portuguese traders in Malacca in the 16th century. It is thought the Portuguese traders were the first to bring the word to Europe. It was first recorded in English in 1577 spelled Giapan.

[Zhu Yuanzhang]

I read that "Riben" was "Ji Phun" in Cantonese and thus Japan, but I don't speak Canto so I don't know.

What I want to know is how Westerners came up with such a perverse system of romanization for Mandarin as Wade-Giles pinyin! Hanyu pinyin wansui!