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Fate, cold palaces and nunneries The downside of being an empress/concubine Rate Topic: -----

#1 User is offline   Elisha 

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Posted 13 March 2006 - 08:58 AM

I'm interested in the power struggles and politics amongst the women folk and I often wonder what happened to the unfortunate rivals who did not die.

I've heard of the Cold Palace - I was just wondering whether any deposed concubines or empresses left in the cold palace were ever influential again?

The person with the most impressive career revival was the former concubine and nun, Wu Zetian. Is there any TV series on her? I'm particularly interested in how she toggled between the empress then and her rival. Are there any well written English books on her?

Also wondering whether they only put concubines from lowly families in the cold palace or nunnery? How about those from high-ranking aristocratic families? If the previous emperor died, what happens to his harem? Do they get any property? money? pension?
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#2 User is offline   Yun 

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Posted 13 March 2006 - 10:27 AM

Hopefully some others can recommend good historical works on Wu Zetian, but for now be warned not to read "The Imperial Mind" by the Singaporean Foo Chek Teck - it is breathtakingly bad.

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I've heard of the Cold Palace - I was just wondering whether any deposed concubines or empresses left in the cold palace were ever influential again?


I don't think there was any concubine or empress who successfully regained the favour of the emperor after having been displaced by a rival.

Han Wudi did forget about Wei Zifu for quite a while between the time he brought her back to the palace (after having picked her up in his sister's dressing room) and the time he made her his favourite concubine and then the empress (the previous empress, Chen A'jiao, was a classic example of victims of the Cold Palace). Emperors can be very forgetful when they have so many women to keep track of.
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#3 User is offline   orchid_dreams 

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    ah, let's take a moment and think... ^_~

Posted 13 March 2006 - 10:05 PM

View PostElisha, on Mar 14 2006, 02:58 AM, said:

The person with the most impressive career revival was the former concubine and nun, Wu Zetian. Is there any TV series on her? I'm particularly interested in how she toggled between the empress then and her rival. Are there any well written English books on her?


there is the sit-com Wu Zetian and also there is a lot about her in Da Ming Gong Ci (大明宫词)
i also know a novel in english called Empress Wu, but I cant remember the author, i'll check next time I go to the library. ^_~
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#4 User is offline   Elisha 

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Posted 13 March 2006 - 11:33 PM

View PostYun, on Mar 13 2006, 11:27 PM, said:

Emperors can be very forgetful when they have so many women to keep track of.


:no: Yes, alas...


View Postorchid_dreams, on Mar 14 2006, 11:05 AM, said:

there is the sit-com Wu Zetian and also there is a lot about her in Da Ming Gong Ci (大明宫词)
i also know a novel in english called Empress Wu, but I cant remember the author, i'll check next time I go to the library. ^_~


Okay, noted, thanks! :)
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#5 User is offline   General_Zhaoyun 

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Posted 16 March 2006 - 12:50 AM

View PostElisha, on Mar 13 2006, 09:58 PM, said:

The person with the most impressive career revival was the former concubine and nun, Wu Zetian. Is there any TV series on her? I'm particularly interested in how she toggled between the empress then and her rival. Are there any well written English books on her?


I actually have a chinese VCD series on Wu Zetian.. it's interesting to watch how ruthless Wu Zetian can be. If I'm not wrong, she killed her two sons and 1 daughter in order to secure her power.
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#6 User is offline   Elisha 

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Posted 16 March 2006 - 01:21 AM

View PostGeneral_Zhaoyun, on Mar 16 2006, 01:50 PM, said:

I actually have a chinese VCD series on Wu Zetian.. it's interesting to watch how ruthless Wu Zetian can be. If I'm not wrong, she killed her two sons and 1 daughter in order to secure her power.


Yes, I can't imagine a woman doing that! It could have been a rumour spread by her political rivals. Speculation, never actually proven? - although, how can one prove a thing like that?
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#7 User is offline   snowybeagle 

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Posted 16 March 2006 - 02:12 AM

View PostElisha, on Mar 16 2006, 02:21 PM, said:

Yes, I can't imagine a woman doing that! It could have been a rumour spread by her political rivals. Speculation, never actually proven? - although, how can one prove a thing like that?


The first death was that of her infant daughter, suffocated to death in the royal nursery. Wu was accused of doing it herself to frame Empress Wang.

Her first son, Li Hong (李弘, AD 652-675) died suddenly, ostensibly of chronic ill-health, rumours of poison by Wu lingered. He was honoured posthumously as Emperor XiaoJing (孝敬皇帝).

Her second son, Li Xian (李贤, AD 654-684) was the second son of Wu appointed as Crown Prince. On a lame pretext that his residence had stockpile of armours (which he was legally entitled to hoard), she stripped his post and banished him. He committed suicide after being tormented by Wu's henchman.

Thus, Wu was at least responsible directly for one of her children's death, even if the other 2 could not be proven.
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