[Yang Zongbao]

There are many stories of the Yang Family's exploits, their fight-to-the-death struggles against the Tanguts, Khitans, and Jurchens.
However, were their struggles depicted often real or not? Did they have a real unique spear style? What about Yang Zongbao and his brothers, or Mu Guiying and the Female Generals? Were they real, and really did fight valiantly exactly as all the legends say? Or were they only partially real, fighting but exaggerated? Or were they completely made up?

[Koolasuchus]

Yang Zongbao, on Nov 12 2004, 01:43 PM, said:

There are many stories of the Yang Family's exploits, their fight-to-the-death struggles against the Tanguts, Khitans, and Jurchens.
However, were their struggles depicted often real or not? Did they have a real unique spear style? What about Yang Zongbao and his brothers, or Mu Guiying and the Female Generals? Were they real, and really did fight valiantly exactly as all the legends say? Or were they only partially real, fighting but exaggerated? Or were they completely made up?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The only fictional character you listed is Yang Zongbao, the names for the rest can be found in actual historical records. Yang Zongbao's character was said to be added to the list of historical figures of the Yang family solely as a way to incorporate Mu Guiying into the story withou offending the male dominate social concensus of the period when the stories were penned.

The Yang family was responsible for the defense of the North during the early North Song Dynasty and many of their members did die in fighting. However beyond that I can't tell you which is fiction and which is real without doing some research of my own.

[Moping4U]

Any info on Yang Ye and his real descendents?

[Zuo Zongtang]

Here a section on the Yang family I found in the book: 中国历史常识

杨家将的故事在中国民间家喻户晓.

历史上杨家将的主要人物是杨业. 北宋初年, 北方的辽国不断进扰北宋朝边境. 杨业带领部队守卫边境重镇雁门关. 公元 980 年, 辽国派 10 万大军攻打雁门关, 自己带领几百名骑兵, 悄悄绕到辽军背后, 给辽军一个突然袭击. 辽军毫无防备, 人人心惊胆战, 大败而归.

雁门关一仗取得胜利后, 杨业又带领宋兵打了几个大胜仗. 从此以后, 辽军一看到"杨"字旗号, 就吓的不敢再战. 人们给杨业起了个外号, 叫"杨无敌".

过了两年, 宋太宗决定大举攻辽, 令宋军分三路进军. 杨业担任西路副帅. 开始, 三路军进展顺利. 后来, 东路军轻率冒进, 导致溃败, 宋军只得撤退. 撤退时, 由于西路主帅指挥错误, 杨业的部队遭到辽国大伏击. 士兵们都战死了. 杨业孤军奋战, 身受几十处创伤仍坚持战斗, 最后被俘. 杨业在辽营里宁死不肯投降, 绝食了三天三夜, 就牺牲了.

杨夜死后, 杨家子孙继承了他的事业. 儿子杨廷昭, 孙子杨文广都在保卫宋朝边境的战争立了功. 民间传说的杨家将的故事就是根据他们的事迹加工而成的.

Translation:

The story of the Yang family is well known by Chinese.

THe main character of this drama is Yang Ye. In the beginings of the Northern Song dynasty, in the north, the Kingdoms of Liao continuously attacked the Song borders. Yang Ye brought his forces to protect the important pass Yanmen. In 980, Liao sent 100,000 troops to attack Yanmen pass. At that time, Yang Ye only had a few thousand troops. He let the majority stay and protect the pass while he himself, along with a few hundred other calvalry, slipped to the rear of the Liao army. He launched a suprise attack and crushed the enemy.

After Yanmen pass, Yangye won several victories afterwards. Liao, upon seeing his command flags, would flee in all dirctions. People gave him the Nickname: "Yang, without an enemy."

After two years, Song Taizong attacked Liao, ordering the army to go forth on three routes. Yang Ye was vice-commander of the Westren Army. At first, the going was easy and progress was made. However, a rash, rapid advance by the Eastren army resulted in defeat. Song was forced to retreat. But because of a mistake in orders, Yang Ye found himself deep in enemy territory, surrounded on all sides. All the soldiers fought bravely, but eventually, they were slaughtered and Yang Ye, wounded, was captured. Yang Ye refused to surrender, and not eating or drinking for 3 days, perished.

After his death, his sons and grandsons, Yang Yanzhao and Yang Wenguang all served Song to the best of their ability, passing on their father and grandfather's legacy.

[Yang Zongbao]

Oh, yes...is Yang Zaixing, one of Yue Fei's lieutenants, also a member of this clan, or did he share the surname by coincidence?

[owen369]

Yang Zongbao, on Mar 1 2005, 08:29 AM, said:

Oh, yes...is Yang Zaixing, one of Yue Fei's lieutenants, also a member of this clan, or did he share the surname by coincidence?

Think he was suppose to be the great grandson of the Yang Ye. According to the chinese serial show, after the Yang family left the court, he appear in Yue Fei army.

[Moose]

owen369, on Feb 28 2005, 11:10 PM, said:

Think he was suppose to be the great grandson of the Yang Ye. According to the chinese serial show, after the Yang family left the court, he appear in Yue Fei army.

Yang ZaiXing was said to be the grandson of Yang WenGuang.

[hansioux]

Clip of Great Holo GoaHi (Singer Opera) of the Clan of Yang story:

四郎 Fourth Son

[tcgim]

I am currently watching a drama series regarding yang jia jiang in the song dynasty, just wanna know whtehr did they really exist, and were they really seven brothers?

[Mok]

tcgim, on Apr 1 2005, 08:38 AM, said:

I am currently watching a drama series regarding yang jia jiang in the song dynasty, just wanna know whtehr did they really exist, and were they really seven brothers?

is it the 1980 TVB one? i'm fairly familiar with that. going by what i read in school however, they should be fact not fiction, unless history annals prove otherwise.

and did u knwo the Yang Tiexin and Yang kang and Yang Guo of jin yong's novels are actually their descendants?

[Goujian]

Mok Kwai Yeng, on Apr 6 2005, 01:56 AM, said:

is it the 1980 TVB one? i'm fairly familiar with that. going by what i read in school however, they should be fact not fiction, unless history annals prove otherwise.

and did u knwo the Yang Tiexin and Yang kang and Yang Guo of jin yong's novels are actually their descendants?

Jin Yong made them so, but that's just fiction. hehe

[Yun]

More directly speaking, Yang Tiexin was supposed to be the great-grandson of Yang Zaixing. Guo Xiaotian (father of Guo Jing) was supposed to be the descendant of Guo Sheng from the Water Margin.

[Mok]

Yun, on Apr 6 2005, 08:47 AM, said:

More directly speaking, Yang Tiexin was supposed to be the great-grandson of Yang Zaixing. Guo Xiaotian (father of Guo Jing) was supposed to be the descendant of Guo Sheng from the Water Margin.

So if Zongbao did not exist as some allege, then who the heck is Wenguang's father? Mu Guiying is Wenguang's mother, or do I have my facts wrong? Ahh...the dangers of watching too many serials...

[tcgim]

tcgim, on Apr 1 2005, 08:38 AM, said:

I am currently watching a drama series regarding yang jia jiang in the song dynasty, just wanna know whtehr did they really exist, and were they really seven brothers?

I am actually refer to "yang2 men2 hu3 jiang4" , it 'is quite new anyway, anyone knows abt the history of yang ye"s fourth son? coz he's the main character in the series....

[snowybeagle]

tcgim, on Apr 9 2005, 09:21 PM, said:

I am actually refer to "yang2 men2 hu3 jiang4" , it 'is quite new anyway, anyone knows abt the history of yang ye"s fourth son? coz he's the main character in the series....

Only according to the legend/folklore that he was captured by the Khitans, married to a princess of theirs and could not return to the Song empire.