[Tyler]

I was wondernig, during the Three Kingdoms time there had to be famous cities that were well known compaired to others. So during this period what were the most famous places or what were they known for.

What cities had a good tourist attraction
What cities had a exellent farming system
What cities had good tax revenues
What cities had good trade
What cities had the most rebellions
What cities was the most peacefull
and so on

[Yun]

It was more like regions and cities having a particular advantage.

Jingzhou was great for trade because it was at a confluence of trade routes.

Chengdu was good for agriculture because of its fertile plain.

Luoyang and Chang'an were known for their rich culture.

Panyu (Guangzhou) was known as a hub for maritime trade, despite being located in a backwater.

[Tyler]

I'm interested to know why
Mo Ling, Wan, and Xu Chang are not known for their trade also.


I'm also interested in what cities had natrual defenses because of the lay of the land and which cities were vunerable to the lay of the land. Where certian cities more at risk of having a natrual disaster than others (sicknesses, floods, blights, etc).

[stupidumboy]

Yun, on Mar 3 2005, 08:32 PM, said:

It was more like regions and cities having a particular advantage.

Jingzhou was great for trade because it was at a confluence of trade routes.

Chengdu was good for agriculture because of its fertile plain.

Luoyang and Chang'an were known for their rich culture.

Panyu (Guangzhou) was known as a hub for maritime trade, despite being located in a backwater.

I personally think the towns around Nanjing(so called 建業-the capital of 吳 kingdom) were better for cultivation and had more harvest than any other towns during the 3 kingdoms.

The sanguoyanyi said the area of 東吳(now currently the jiangsu and zhejiang province) was very prosperous due to the fertile land.

To simply answer for other questions based on my humble knowledges-

The best area where the merchants gather for trading was probably 荊州.襄陽 area (currently so called 江陵 -jiangling) because it was the place where the 3 kingdoms meet in boarders and many of well talented people and merchants gathered there and wait for the time of picked by the kingdoms)

8 letters idiomatic phrase.
南船北馬 (ships from the south and horses from the north -simply stands for the transportation at that time )輻輳八方-(gather here from the every 8 directions)

The place indicates 襄陽.

[Jiang Qin]

The Sichuan Basin was one of the most famous area for agriculture throuout Chinese history.

Although the areas near Jiangsu and Zhejiang province may be well known for agriculture (I doubt there were really extensive cultivation in the area and what's more because it was just SGYY, but maybe there were, just not sure )
I think the areas were more well known for their trading activities and the supplies of their unique talented scholars.

[stupidumboy]

Jiang Qin, on Mar 4 2005, 05:15 PM, said:

The Sichuan Basin was one of the most famous area for agriculture throuout Chinese history.

Although the areas near Jiangsu and Zhejiang province may be well known for agriculture (I doubt there were really extensive cultivation in the area and what's more because it was just SGYY, but maybe there were, just not sure )
I think the areas were more well known for their trading activities.

I am not so sure but I just told my opinion based on my memory of reading sanguoyanyi.

Probably the 東吳 area might be the most hectic place for trading with foreign nations during the 3 kingdoms because at that time 會稽(currently suzhou) and 南海 (currently GZ) areas were not very well develpoed and had not many trading and cultural interchangement with Han Chinese people in the central districts of Chinese continent.

Just my humble assumption..

[Yun]

Quote

Although the areas near Jiangsu and Zhejiang province may be well known for agriculture (I doubt there were really extensive cultivation in the area and what's more because it was just SGYY, but maybe there were, just not sure

The area around the Taihu (Lake Tai) became the richest rice-growing land later on in Chinese history, but this started in the Age of Fragmentation. In the Three Kingdoms period, Jiangnan was still an underdeveloped frontier area.

[Jiang Qin]

Actually I'm still confused about "Jiangnan". It was being used to refer many places in the eastern Wu area. Actually where is the real Jiangnan? Is it the lower banks of the Chang Jiang area? or ..... ?

[snowybeagle]

Jiang Qin, on Mar 10 2005, 05:08 PM, said:

Actually I'm still confused about "Jiangnan". It was being used to refer many places in the eastern Wu area. Actually where is the real Jiangnan? Is it the lower banks of the Chang Jiang area? or ..... ?

JiangNan (江南) refer to the general area south of the YangZi reaches of the Long River, or south of the middle and lower reaches of the Long River - which cover a great deal of territories.

Some olden records included YangZhou (扬州) as belonging to Jiang Nan, but technically, the city is on the northern bank of the YangZi.

In a more narrow sense, JiangNan refer to southern parts of present day JiangSu province (江苏南部), ZheJiang province and eastern portions of the JiangXi province.

FYI, JiangDong (江东) does not refer to east of the Long River in the manner that JiangNan refer to south of the Long River.

JiangDong (江东) and JiangXi (江西) are contractions of JiangNanDong (江南东) and JiangNanXi (江南西) respectively, which means eastern JiangNan and western JiangNan.

The Eastern Wu state from the Three Kingdoms cover mainly JiangDong, especially in the earlier period.

[ZhongDa]

but i read some books and in those the south is defined geographically as south of Huai river.

[snowybeagle]

ZhongDa, on Apr 6 2005, 02:22 AM, said:

but i read some books and in those the south is defined geographically as south of Huai river.

Technically speaking, the Huai river is not a "jiang". The "jiang" is believed to be an adoption of a southern language term for the Long River.

But for some people who considered YangZhou as part of jiangnan, the only viable explanation they could be give is to use the Huai river.

Any other forummers able to provide more insight?

[Yun]

In the modern context, the demarcation between north China and south China is indeed a line running along the Huai River and the Qinling Range. But south China is 'nanfang', and not Jiangnan. Jiangnan is a narrower concept that basically refers to the Nanjing-Suzhou-Hangzhou area.

Yangzhou was included in Jiangnan after the Sui because the opening of the Grand Canal and the patronage of Sui Yangdi as his southern capital made it the northernmost extension of Jiangnan culture.