[Daniel]

I read Bai Shouyi's chapter on myths and legends of Chinese history. It talks about a mythical chieftain of the Yi tribe of pre-Xia eastern China, named Chiyou. He fought Huang Di and lost, despite unleashing wind and rain as well as soldiers against the Ji. Supposedly, Chiyou then died and went to heaven, where he became the constellation called "The Banner of Chiyou."

I would love to know where this constellation is. Does anybody know how to find it in the sky? Does it approximate one of the Greek constellations, or several of them?

While I'm on the subject of constellations, I remember Carl Sagan in the TV series Cosmos talking about the Big Dipper in the constellation of Ursa Major. He mentioned that the Chinese interpreted the Big Dipper as the Celestial Bureaucrat riding in his chariot and surrounded by his eternally hopeful petitioners. Is this true?

[Yun]

Well, this site: http://www.mythopedi...fo/22-china.htm says that Chi You's Banner was a type of comet.

For a chart of Chinese constellations (in Chinese), see:
http://www.chinapage...t/nexhibit6.gif
http://www.chinapage...t/nexhibit5.gif

For a list of the 28 lunar mansions (the Chinese zodiac), see:
http://en.wikipedia....e_constellation
http://www.chinapage...ellation28.html

Two interesting pics of the constellations from http://www.starlab.com/slcylmyth.html :

[Koolasuchus]

Daniel, on Apr 15 2005, 07:00 AM, said:

I read Bai Shouyi's chapter on myths and legends of Chinese history.  It talks about a mythical chieftain of the Yi tribe of pre-Xia eastern China, named Chiyou.  He fought Huang Di and lost, despite unleashing wind and rain as well as soldiers against the Ji.  Supposedly, Chiyou then died and went to heaven, where he became the constellation called "The Banner of Chiyou."

I would love to know where this constellation is.  Does anybody know how to find it in the sky?  Does it approximate one of the Greek constellations, or several of them?

While I'm on the subject of constellations, I remember Carl Sagan in the TV series Cosmos talking about the Big Dipper in the constellation of Ursa Major.  He mentioned that the Chinese interpreted the Big Dipper as the Celestial Bureaucrat riding in his chariot and surrounded by his eternally hopeful petitioners.  Is this true?

Chiyou was considered evil incarnate, there was no way ancient Chinese of Hua-Xia descend will name a constellation (thus reserving a place in the Heaven) after him.

[Daniel]

Well, the text definitely says Chiyou's banner was a constellation. The exact text is: "After he died, Chiyou ascended to Heaven, and became a constellation known as 'the Banner of Chiyou.'" On page 49, right near the beginning of Chapter III.

Maybe "constellation" is a mistranslation, and "comet" is what it says in the original Chinese? Anyone have the original Chinese edition?

Koolasuchus's information makes the matter even stranger, because Bai goes on to write, "Both Huang Di and Chiyou were worshipped later as gods of war." Evil incarnate was worshipped as a god?

Then again, maybe Professor Bai just flubbed it. I already have reason to believe he made one medium-size mistake about the Huang Di myth, namely attributing the invention of silkworm breeding and silk weaving to Huang Di, rather than to his wife Su Ling.

[Yun]

Quote

Koolasuchus's information makes the matter even stranger, because Bai goes on to write, "Both Huang Di and Chiyou were worshipped later as gods of war." Evil incarnate was worshipped as a god?

Well, according to a book that I have, both Huangdi and Chiyou were credited by different sources with being the inventor of the sword (jian). Chiyou is even credited with originating the idea of weapons and armour.

[Koolasuchus]

Yun, on Apr 15 2005, 12:10 PM, said:

Well, according to a book that I have, both Huangdi and Chiyou were credited by different sources with being the inventor of the sword (jian). Chiyou is even credited with originating the idea of weapons and armour.

The most popular legend (being the ones that appeared the most often these days) has Chiyou's tribe invented the bronze helmets and swords. It was said that Chiyou and his 81 brothers each wore a bronze helmet and wields a bronze sword, and were blood thirsty in battle.