[bhchao]

The Tang dynasty had two great prime ministers who contributed to the success of the Zhenguan reign and helped lay the foundation of the Kaiyuan period.

Wei Zheng was a very direct prime minister who was not afraid to speak his mind in front of Tang Taizong. Wei Zheng's bluntness with Taizong often got him into trouble, and both men constantly engaged each other in heated arguments. Taizong would often leave the room fuming. One time Taizong threatened to behead Weizheng following one heated discussion.

But Taizong did not execute Wei Zheng. Remarkably, the emperor eventually came around to seeing the wisdom of his prime minister's words, and concluded that Wei Zheng was right.

Wei Zheng was Li Jiancheng's advisor prior to the Xuanwumen coup. Despite the fact that Weizheng advised Li Jiancheng to eliminate Li Shimin, Li Shimin did not kill Wei Zheng following the success of the coup. Li Shimin's decision to retain his slain brother's advisor as his prime minister turned out to be a shrewd move.

During the Zhenguan reign, Wei Zheng often criticized Taizong's spending habits. This helped check the extravagance that might have brought fiscal distress to the country. The luxurious indulgences of Sui Yangdi and Qianlong were examples of two emperors who helped bring down their respective dynasties.

One time Taizong embarked on a campaign to eliminate dishonesty and corruption in his government by having undercover agents pose as ordinary civilians offering bribes to government officials in return for favors. The purpose of the campaign was to find out which government officials accepted the "false" bribes. One official did, and Taizong wanted to execute him. But Wei Zheng told Taizong "why execute him when you brought out his behavior through a fake campaign?" According to Wei Zheng, the best way to bring out good behavior from the subordinate was to have the emperor behave as a good model himself in front of his subjects.

Taizong saw the wisdom of these words and did not execute the official. When Wei Zheng died, Taizong was saddened and erected a monument to honor his prime minister.

The other great prime minister during Tang was Di Renjie, Wu Zetian's prime minister. Strangely, she deferred to him while being ruthless to other court officials. Di was not born into an aristocratic family. He took the civil service exams and gradually rose through the ranks, eventually becoming a detective solving murder cases in the provinces. His work in the provinces caught the eye of Wu Zetian, who was looking for talented people to fill her government. After becoming her prime minister, Di was indispensable. There were many aristocratic factions within the government who hated her. Di headed a meritocracy who served as a bulwark against her opponents.

Di, like Wei Zheng before him, also criticized his monarch. He often spoke out frankly against Wu's explicit or unscrupulous behaviors in front of her. There was an incident when Di Renjie and Wu Zetian were discussing a policy issue and she became angry with him when he sharply disagreed with her. Di walked to one of the pillars in the hall, pounded his head repeatedly onto the pillar, and told her that he was willing to keep pounding his head until he killed himself. She begged him to stop, and finally agreed to adopt his proposal.

Wu Zetian could not afford to get rid of a loyal advisor like Di Renjie. He certainly knew that.

Without these two men, the first half of the Tang dynasty would not have been the success it was.

[General_Zhaoyun]

As commented by history, those great prime minister are those who are not afraid of speaking directly or providing advice to the Emperor. Only those Xiaoren 小人 (despicable men) are those who only speak words that please or flatter the emperor.

Wei Zheng often spoked too directly that often humiliated Emperor Taizong in front of others. To some point in time, Emperor Taizong was so annoyed that he even thought of killing him.

Di Renjie was probably the most influential Prime Minister during Wu Zetian's time. Like Wei Zheng, he was not afraid of speaking, even though Wu Zetian was a ruthless lady.

[Rong Qin Wang]

Zunjing de China History Forum members,

I would like to thank bhchao for providing us his lengthy article on these two great prime ministers of the Tang Dynasty. I don’t have anymore comments on this topic since General Zhaoyun had covered everything.

When speaking of Di Renjie, I have always wondered whether he was really that loyal to Wu Zetian. Do you think that Di Renjie was thinking for Wu Zetian when he proposed that Prince Li Xian should be made crown prince, or was he really a true advocate for the Tang Dynasty? What were his real intentions?

Of course, his argument that only a son can make ritual offerings to his mother sounded very logical, but was that the entire reason?

Xie Xie,

[snowybeagle]

From all I have read, Di Renjie's loyalty was to the country rather than the regime. Thus, despite many officials unwilling to serve a female ruler, much less a usurper, he remained in the service for the benefits of the citizens.

I suppose in his heart, he considered Wu Zetian's right to rule as being based on shaky ground, and that ultimately, the acceptance of her as a ruler was still primarily due to her being an Empress to Emperor Gaozong and a mother to Gaozong's heirs.

Even though she was in charge, she could, in a grudging way, be considered as a caretaker ruler or a regent on behalf of the Li ruling house of the Tang dynasty.

As such, Di would probably have perceived that any attempt to place the throne *permanently* to a non-member of the Li ruling house would lead to an upheaval, a transgression against Heaven's mandate and an outright rebellion.

Di Renjie was at heart a staunch Confucianist and conservative. Despite the widening popularity of Buddhism and Wu Zetian's personal sponsorship for it, he opposed allowing its influence into the state affairs. Once, when Wu Zetian was on her way to view Buddhist relics, he persuaded her to turn back, highlighting that Buddhism was a "religion of the barbarians".

Di saw the Tang Dynasty as the only true rightful regime.
As for his argument to Wu Zetian about appointment of heir, it was quite logical, but it also probably addressed the true concerns of Wu Zetian.

Being an astute person, Wu Zetian should have realised that neither the candidates from her Wu clan nor her both own surviving sons would make really worthy emperors.

But if she appointed Wu Chengsi or Wu Sansi, after her death, it would be their own mothers honoured in the temple, and she'd have no control whatsoever about her place in it. Even if she got some place of honour, she'd have to share it with another.

[Rong Qin Wang]

snowybeagle, on Nov 15 2006, 11:51 PM, said:

From all I have read, Di Renjie's loyalty was to the country rather than the regime. Thus, despite many officials unwilling to serve a female ruler, much less a usurper, he remained in the service for the benefits of the citizens.

I suppose in his heart, he considered Wu Zetian's right to rule as being based on shaky ground, and that ultimately, the acceptance of her as a ruler was still primarily due to her being an Empress to Emperor Gaozong and a mother to Gaozong's heirs.

Even though she was in charge, she could, in a grudging way, be considered as a caretaker ruler or a regent on behalf of the Li ruling house of the Tang dynasty.

As such, Di would probably have perceived that any attempt to place the throne *permanently* to a non-member of the Li ruling house would lead to an upheaval, a transgression against Heaven's mandate and an outright rebellion.

Di Renjie was at heart a staunch Confucianist and conservative. Despite the widening popularity of Buddhism and Wu Zetian's personal sponsorship for it, he opposed allowing its influence into the state affairs. Once, when Wu Zetian was on her way to view Buddhist relics, he persuaded her to turn back, highlighting that Buddhism was a "religion of the barbarians".

Di saw the Tang Dynasty as the only true rightful regime.
As for his argument to Wu Zetian about appointment of heir, it was quite logical, but it also probably addressed the true concerns of Wu Zetian.

Being an astute person, Wu Zetian should have realised that neither the candidates from her Wu clan nor her both own surviving sons would make really worthy emperors.

But if she appointed Wu Chengsi or Wu Sansi, after her death, it would be their own mothers honoured in the temple, and she'd have no control whatsoever about her place in it. Even if she got some place of honour, she'd have to share it with another.

Zunjing de Snowybeagle Xian Sheng,

Hmm, I also had a feeling that Di Renjie’s loyalty was to the civilians rather than to any regimes. That was probably why he still served dutifully under a female Emperor as she proved to be a capable leader. Wu Zetian had the ability to create a prosperous era for the civilians. So, of course, Di Renjie would have no problem being a Prime Minister under her as long as she still remained compassionate toward the commoners.

Being well-versed in literature and traditions, Di Renjie would consider Wu Zetian’s right to the throne as being based on collapsible ground since her acceptance was due to the fact that she was a member of the Li Imperial family through a marriage to Tang Gaozong. Despite Wu Zetian’s unpopularity, both her sons were very much supported by others for the restoration of the Tang Dynasty. With this in mind, Wu Zetian can be reluctantly considered as regent, serving on behalf of her two incapable sons. There was high hope for the restoration of the Tang Dynasty as Wu Zetian had kept her fourth son as the Crown Prince at the beginning of her reign.

It is true that the Tang Dynasty was very popular among the civilians because the prosperity of Zhen Guan clearly remained in their heart. With any permanent changes to the “Mandate of Heaven” from the Li Imperial family would result in internal rebellions. In fact, there were several rebellions led by the Imperial Princes when Wu Zetian deposed Tang Zhongzong and refused to give complete authority to Tang Ruizong. So, you can imagine what it would be like if Wu Zetian decided to pass the throne to her nephew instead.

Di Renjie would have never allowed rebellions to beset the country as the civilians would suffer the most as a consequence. In order to ensure a stable succession of Prince Li Xian, Di Renjie took a dive at attacking Wu Zetian’s weakness, and succeeded. It was clearly obvious that if Wu Zetian could have passed the throne to her nephew, then she would have already done so immediately after founding the Zhou Dynasty.

Well, when Wu Zetian realized that neither her sons nor her nephews would make really worthy Emperors, she would have most likely preferred her sons over her nephews due to the reasons that Di Renjie had previously stated above. I also believed that in her heart, Wu Zetian still had to feel somewhat guilty for seizing the throne from her sons. So, allowing her sons to revert back to the Tang Dynasty was the right thing to do.

Thank you for your explanation as it was extremely beneficial to me!

Xie Xie,