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Fireice
I always hear about the iron hat princes of the qing dynasty but I never knew what they were..

Does anyone know what is iron hat princes and their ranking in the prince hereditary..
wlee15
The iron hat princes were princes who were allowed to transfer their title their heirs perpetualy. All other titles ended when the holder dies, however by convention their designated heirs were assigned a rank 1 grade below that of their predecessor.

The orginal eight iron hat princes were Dorgon a Son of Nurhachi and Regent of the Qing dynasty until his death, Jirgalang a son of Surhachi (Nurhachi's younger brother), Daishan a son of Nurhachi, Dodo (Dorgon's younger full brother), Hauge (the eldest son of Hong Taiji), Sose (another son of Nurhachi), Yoto (a son of Daishan), and a grandson of Daishan, who I believe is Lekedehun. The first 6 are first rank princes, while the last two were second rank princes.

You can find the information in Chinese here

http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/铁ñ...#23376;王
kaiselin
QUOTE (wlee15 @ Jan 2 2008, 04:30 AM) *
The iron hat princes were princes who were allowed to transfer their title their heirs perpetualy. All other titles ended when the holder dies, however by convention their designated heirs were assigned a rank 1 grade below that of their predecessor.


So if I read that right, each generation would loose a rank?
Fireice
QUOTE (wlee15 @ Jan 2 2008, 03:30 AM) *
The iron hat princes were princes who were allowed to transfer their title their heirs perpetualy. All other titles ended when the holder dies, however by convention their designated heirs were assigned a rank 1 grade below that of their predecessor.

The orginal eight iron hat princes were Dorgon a Son of Nurhachi and Regent of the Qing dynasty until his death, Jirgalang a son of Surhachi (Nurhachi's younger brother), Daishan a son of Nurhachi, Dodo (Dorgon's younger full brother), Hauge (the eldest son of Hong Taiji), Sose (another son of Nurhachi), Yoto (a son of Daishan), and a grandson of Daishan, who I believe is Lekedehun. The first 6 are first rank princes, while the last two were second rank princes.

You can find the information in Chinese here

http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/铁ñ...#23376;王


1st rank prince is Qin Wang?

How about the sons of the Emperor who did not become Emperor? As the generation goes by they get demoted 1 rank each generation?
wlee15
QUOTE (kaiselin @ Jan 2 2008, 02:38 AM) *
So if I read that right, each generation would loose a rank?


Yes but only for the Successor, other sons would be given much lower ranks apparently 6-8 lower than their father according to this site.
http://www.4dw.net/royalark/China/titles.htm

QUOTE (Fireice @ Jan 2 2008, 02:46 AM) *
1st rank prince is Qin Wang?

How about the sons of the Emperor who did not become Emperor? As the generation goes by they get demoted 1 rank each generation?


Yes the 1st rank prince is Qin Wang, son and brothers would be given high ranks (assuming they stayed in the Emperor's favour) ranging from Qing Wang, Jun Wang or Bei Le, and unless they were given the right to transfer their titles perpetually which was extremely rare.
Fireice
QUOTE (wlee15 @ Jan 2 2008, 03:30 AM) *


In chinese leh.

Got english version?
Liu Bang
QUOTE (Fireice @ Jan 2 2008, 03:46 AM) *
1st rank prince is Qin Wang?

How about the sons of the Emperor who did not become Emperor? As the generation goes by they get demoted 1 rank each generation?


Yes, fireice, a first rank prince is a qin wang.

If the sons of the Emperor did not become the Emperor, they remain in their respective ranks (like Qin wang, Jun wang, beile and so on) unless the new Emperor decides to promote them.

I don't think the sentence is true that as the generation goes by they get demoted 1 rank. For instance, let's look as Prince Zheng, Jierhalang. His title of Prince Zheng (qin wang) was passed down from generation to generation. However, I am not sure if this applies to other princes (I'm not an expert on Qing Dynasty history).

Examples of Iron Hat Princes (just a few):

1. Duoergun
2. Duoduo
3. Jierhalang
4. Haoge

Liu Bang
Liu Bang
Actually, the correct term should be Iron Cap Princes (铁帽子王), not Iron Hat Princes. I just checked it out.
Rong Qin Wang
QUOTE (wlee15 @ Jan 2 2008, 01:30 AM) *
The iron hat princes were princes who were allowed to transfer their title their heirs perpetualy. All other titles ended when the holder dies, however by convention their designated heirs were assigned a rank 1 grade below that of their predecessor.

The orginal eight iron hat princes were Dorgon a Son of Nurhachi and Regent of the Qing dynasty until his death, Jirgalang a son of Surhachi (Nurhachi's younger brother), Daishan a son of Nurhachi, Dodo (Dorgon's younger full brother), Hauge (the eldest son of Hong Taiji), Sose (another son of Nurhachi), Yoto (a son of Daishan), and a grandson of Daishan, who I believe is Lekedehun. The first 6 are first rank princes, while the last two were second rank princes.

You can find the information in Chinese here

http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/铁ñ...#23376;王


Zunjing de China History Forum members,

I have taken into account the information posted by Wlee15 to compose a list of Iron-Cap Princes.

The six original Iron-Cap Princes of the first rank were:

1.] Prince Li: Daishan (2nd son of Nurhachi)
2.] Prince Rui: Dorgon (14th son of Nurhachi)
3.] Prince Yu: Dodo (15th son of Nurhachi)
4.] Prince Zheng: Jierhalang (6th son of Surhachi, who was Nurhachi’s 3rd younger brother)
5.] Prince Su: Haoge (eldest son of Huang Taiji)
6.] Prince Ch’eng Tse: Sose (5th son of Huang Taiji)

The two original Iron-Cap Princes of the second rank were:

1.] Prince K’o Chi’in: Yoto (eldest son of Daishan)
2.] Prince Shun Ch’eng: Lekedehun: (2nd son of Sahaliyen, who was Daishan’s 3rd son)

The four additional Iron-Cap Princes of the first rank were:

1.] Prince Yi: Yinxiang (13th surviving son of Emperor Kang Xi)
2.] Prince Gong: Yixin (6th son of Emperor Dao Guang)
3.] Prince Chun: Yixuan (7th son of Emperor Dao Guang)
4.] Prince Qing: Yikuang (eldest son of Mien Hsing, who was the 6th son of Yonglin, who was the 17th son of Emperor Qian Long)


I would like to apologize profusely for any misspellings since I am not completely fluent in pinyin transliterations; therefore, I would really appreciate any corrections!

Wlee15,

Were there any specific reasons why most of the princely titles only received one character, while three princes (Ch’eng Tse, K’o Chi’in and Shun Ch’eng) were bestowed with two-character titles? Was it due to the excessive number of Iron-Cap Princes, there were not sufficient one-character designations for all the princes?

Another question: Were the Iron-Cap Princes granted the privilege of personally selecting their successors among any of their surviving sons? Or was it mandatory for the princes’ eldest sons to automatically succeed their fathers’ titles providing that there were no serious faults to their conducts?

Xie Xie,
RQW

Rong Qin Wang
清朝世袭铁帽子王家谱


1、和硕礼亲王(承序:代善、满达海、常阿岱、杰书、椿泰、崇安、巴尔图、永恩、麟趾、全龄、世铎、诚厚,历十代十五王)
  代善:太祖二子,和硕礼烈亲王
  满达海:代善七子,和硕巽简亲王(改号,后追降为贝勒)
  常阿岱:满达海子,和硕巽亲王(后降为贝勒)
  杰书:代善孙,和硕康良亲王(改号康)
  椿泰:杰书子,和硕康悼亲王
  崇安:杰书子,椿泰弟,和硕康修亲王
  巴尔图:杰书子,椿泰、崇安弟,和硕康简亲王
  永恩:崇安子,和硕礼恭亲王(复号礼)
  昭梿:永恩子,和硕礼亲王(后革爵)
  永諲:崇安子,永恩弟,追封和硕礼亲王
  麟趾:永諲子,和硕礼安亲王
  锡春:麟趾子,追封和硕礼亲王
  全龄:锡春子,和硕礼和亲王
  世铎:全龄子,和硕礼恪亲王
  诚厚:世铎子,和硕礼敦亲王
  
  2、和硕睿亲王(承序:多尔衮、多尔博、淳颖、宝恩、瑞恩、仁寿、德长、魁斌,历十一代十二王)
  多尔衮:太祖十四子,和硕睿忠亲王
  多尔博:多铎五子,出为多尔衮嗣,和硕睿亲王(后削爵),追封
  苏尔发:多尔博子,追封和硕睿亲王
  塞勒:苏尔发子,追封和硕睿亲王
  功宜布:塞勒子,追封和硕睿亲王
  如松:功宜布子,追封和硕睿亲王
  淳颖:如松子,出为多尔衮嗣,和硕睿恭亲王
  宝恩:淳颖子,和硕睿慎亲王
  瑞恩:淳颖子,宝恩弟,和硕睿勤亲王
  仁寿:瑞恩子,和硕睿僖亲王
  德长:仁寿子,和硕睿 亲王
  魁斌:德长子,和硕睿亲王
  
  3、和硕郑亲王(承序:济尔哈朗、济度、德塞、喇布、雅布、雅尔江阿、神保住、德沛、奇阿通、丰讷亨、积哈纳、乌尔恭阿、端华、承志、庆至、凯泰、昭煦,历十代二十六王)
  济尔哈朗:显祖孙,太祖三弟舒尔哈齐六子,和硕郑献亲王
  济度:济尔哈朗二子,和硕简纯亲王(改号简)
  德塞:济度三子,和硕简惠亲王
  喇布:济度二子,和硕简亲王(后追革爵)
  雅布:济度五子,和硕简修亲王
  雅尔江阿:雅布长子,和硕简亲王(后革爵)
  神保住:雅布十四子,和硕简亲王(后革爵)
  费扬武:济尔哈朗八弟,追封和硕简亲王
  傅喇塔:费扬武四子,追封和硕简亲王
  福存:傅喇塔子,追封和硕简亲王
  德沛:福存子,和硕简仪亲王
  巴尔堪:济尔哈朗四子,追封和硕简亲王
  巴赛:巴尔堪子,追封和硕简亲王
  奇阿通:巴赛子,和硕简勤亲王
  丰讷亨:奇阿通长子,和硕简恪亲王
  积哈纳:丰讷亨子,和硕郑恭亲王(复号郑)
  乌尔恭阿:积哈纳子,和硕郑慎亲王
  端华:乌尔恭阿子,和硕郑亲王(后革爵)
  经讷亨:奇阿通二子,追封和硕郑亲王
  伊丰额:经讷亨子,追封和硕郑亲王
  西朗阿:伊丰额子,追封和硕郑亲王
  承志:西朗阿子,和硕郑亲王(后革爵)
  松德:积哈纳子,追封和硕郑亲王
  庆至:松德子,和硕郑顺亲王
  凯泰:庆至子,和硕郑恪亲王
  昭煦:凯泰子,和硕郑亲王
  
  4、和硕豫亲王(承序:多铎、多尼、鄂扎、董额、德昭、如松、修龄、裕丰、裕兴、裕全、义道、本格、懋林,历九代十七王)
  多铎:太祖十五子,和硕豫通亲王
  多尼:多铎长子,多罗信宣和郡王(改号信,原亲王)
  鄂扎:多尼子,多罗信郡王
  董额:多铎三子,多罗信郡王
  德昭:鄂扎子,多罗信郡王
  多尔博:多铎五子,追封信郡王
  苏尔发:多尔博子,追封信郡王
  塞勒:苏尔发子,追封信郡王
  功宜布:塞勒子,追封信郡王
  如松:功宜布子,多罗信恪郡王
  修龄:德昭子,和硕豫良亲王(复号、爵)
  裕丰:修龄子,和硕豫亲王(后革爵)
  裕兴:修龄子,裕丰弟,和硕豫亲王(后革爵)
  裕全:修龄子,裕丰、裕兴弟,和硕豫厚亲王
义道:裕全子,和硕豫慎亲王
  本格:义道子,和硕豫诚亲王
  懋林:本格子,和硕豫亲王
  
  5、和硕肃亲王(承序:豪格、富绶、丹臻、衍潢、蕴著、永锡、敬敏、华丰、隆懃、善耆,历九代十王)
  豪格:太宗长子,和硕肃武亲王
  富绶:豪格子,和硕显懿亲王(改号显)
  丹臻:富绶子,和硕显密亲王
  衍潢:丹臻子,和硕显谨亲王
  蕴著:富绶孙,和硕肃勤亲王(复号肃)
  永锡:丹臻孙,和硕肃恭亲王
  敬敏:永锡子,和硕肃慎亲王
  华丰:敬敏子,和硕肃恪亲王
  隆懃:华丰子,和硕肃良亲王
  善耆:隆懃子,和硕肃忠亲王
  
  6、和硕庄亲王(承序:硕塞、博果铎、允禄、永献、绵课、奕镈、绵护、绵深、奕仁、载勋、载功,历八代十一王)
  硕塞:太宗五子,和硕承泽裕亲王
  博果铎:硕塞长子,和硕庄靖亲王(改号庄)
  允禄:圣祖十六子,出为博果铎嗣,和硕庄恪亲王
  永献:允禄孙,和硕庄慎亲王
  绵课:允禄曾孙,和硕庄襄亲王
  奕镈:绵课子,和硕庄亲王(后革爵)
  绵护:允禄曾孙,和硕庄勤亲王
  绵深:绵护弟,和硕庄质亲王
  奕仁:绵深子,和硕庄厚亲王
  载勋:奕仁子,和硕庄亲王(后革爵)
  载功:奕仁子,载勋弟,和硕庄亲王
  
  7、多罗克勤郡王(承序:岳讬、罗洛宏、罗科铎、纳尔图、纳尔福、纳尔苏、福彭、庆宁、庆恒、雅朗阿、恒谨、恒元、尚格、承硕、庆惠、晋祺、崧杰、宴森,历十三代十八王)
  岳讬:代善长子,追封多罗克勤郡王
  罗洛宏:岳讬长子,多罗衍禧介郡王(改号衍禧)
  罗科铎:罗洛宏子,多罗平比郡王(改号平)
  纳尔图:罗科铎子,多罗平郡王(后革爵)
  纳尔福:罗科铎子,纳尔图弟,多罗平悼郡王
  纳尔苏:纳尔福子,多罗平郡王(后革爵)
  福彭:纳尔苏子,多罗平敏郡王
  庆宁:福彭子,多罗平僖郡王
  庆恒:纳尔苏孙,多罗克勤良郡王(复号克勤)
  雅朗阿:纳尔图孙,多罗克勤庄郡王
  恒谨:雅朗阿子,多罗克勤郡王(后革爵)
  恒元:雅朗阿子,恒谨弟,追封多罗克勤郡王
  尚格:恒元子,多罗克勤简郡王
  承硕:尚格子,多罗克勤恪郡王
  庆惠:承硕子,多罗克勤敬郡王
  晋祺:庆惠子,多罗克勤诚郡王
  崧杰:晋祺子,多罗克勤顺郡王
  宴森:崧杰子,多罗克勤郡王
  
  8、多罗顺承郡王(承序:勒克德浑、勒尔锦、勒尔贝、扬奇、充保、布穆巴、诺罗布、锡保、熙良、泰斐英阿、恒昌、伦柱、春山、庆恩、讷勒赫,历十代十五王)
  勒克德浑:代善孙,萨哈璘二子,多罗顺承恭惠郡王
  勒尔锦:勒克德浑子,多罗顺承郡王(后革爵)
  勒尔贝:勒尔锦长子,多罗顺承郡王
  扬奇:勒尔锦二子,多罗顺承郡王
  充保:勒尔锦三子,多罗顺承郡王
  布穆巴:勒尔锦四子,多罗顺承郡王(后革爵)
  诺罗布:勒克德浑三子,多罗顺承忠郡王
  锡保:诺罗布子,和硕顺承亲王(后革爵)
  熙良:锡保子,多罗顺承恪郡王
  泰斐英阿:熙良子,多罗顺承恭郡王
  恒昌:泰斐英阿子,多罗顺承慎郡王
  伦柱:恒昌子,多罗顺承简郡王
  春山:伦柱子,多罗顺承勤郡王
  庆恩:春山子,多罗顺承敏郡王
  讷勒赫:庆恩子,多罗顺承质郡王
  
  9、和硕怡亲王(承序:允祥、弘晓、永琅、奕勋、载坊、载垣、载敦、溥静、毓麒,历七代九王)
  允祥:圣祖十三子,和硕怡贤亲王
  弘晓:允祥七子,和硕怡僖亲王
  永琅:弘晓子,和硕怡恭亲王
  奕勋:永琅孙,和硕怡恪亲王
  载坊:奕勋子,和硕怡 亲王
  载垣:奕勋子,载坊弟,和硕怡亲王(后革爵)
  载敦:允祥五世孙,弘皎四世孙,和硕怡端亲王
  溥静:载敦子,和硕怡 亲王
  毓麒:溥静子,和硕怡亲王
  
  10、和硕恭亲王(承序:奕欣、溥伟,历三代二王)
  奕欣:宣宗六子,和硕恭忠亲王
  溥伟:奕欣孙,载滢子,出为奕欣长子载溦后,和硕恭亲王
  
  11、和硕醇亲王(承序:奕譞、载沣,历二代二王)
  奕譞:宣宗七子,和硕醇贤亲王
  载沣:奕譞子,和硕醇亲王
  
  12、和硕庆亲王(历一代一王)
  奕劻:高宗曾孙,永璘孙,绵性子,和硕庆密亲王


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