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Non-Han Nan Ban
From what I've read, the antiquarianism in the Song Dynasty (960-1279 CE) was much more than a haughty art trend; apparently, the collection and study of old relics was taken pretty seriously by some scholars of the period.

I just recently added this information to Shen Kuo's article on Wikipedia (as well as the article for Song Dynasty, noting that the Chinese of the Song period claimed to have found relics dating back to the Shang), with info taken from:

*Fraser, Julius Thomas and Francis C. Haber. (1986). Time, Science, and Society in China and the West. Amherst: University of Massachusetts Press. ISBN 0-87023-495-1.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shen_Kuo

QUOTE
Many of Shen Kuo's contemporaries were interested in antiquarian pursuits of collecting old artworks. They were also interested in archaeological pursuits, although for rather different reasons than why Shen Kuo held an interest in archaeology. While Shen's educated Confucian contemporaries were interested in obtaining ancient relics and antiques in order to revive their use in rituals, Shen was more concerned with how items from archeological finds were originally manufactured and what their functionality would have been, based on empirical evidence. Shen Kuo criticized those in his day who reconstructed ancient ritual objects using only their imagination and not the tangible evidence from archeological digs or finds. Shen also disdained the notion of others that these objects were products of the "sages" or the aristocratic class of antiquity, rightfully crediting the items' manufacture and production to the common working people and artisans of previous eras. Fraser and Haber write that Shen Kuo "advocated the use of an interdisciplinary approach to archaeology and practiced such an approach himself through his work in metallurgy, optics, and geometry in the study of ancient measures."

While working in the Bureau of Astronomy, Shen Kuo's interest in archaeology and old relics led him to reconstruct an armillary sphere from existing models as well as from ancient texts that could provide additional information. Shen used ancient mirrors while conducting his optics experiments. He observed ancient weaponry, describing the scaled sight devices on ancient crossbows and the ancients' production of swords with composite blades that had a midrib of wrought iron and low-carbon steel while having two sharp edges of high-carbon steel. Being a knowledgeable musician, Shen also suggested suspending an ancient bell by using a hollow handle.


I'd like to know more about archeology as a discipline practiced in pre-modern China, not today's modern China. Shen Kuo had a genius perspective on the study considering the time period he lived, but were there many others who took the study of archeology as seriously as Shen? It seems as if he criticized everyone else for not taking the study of ancient relics seriously enough. I remember reading a while back about how the ancient Chinese (can't remember which dynasty now) were so interested in collecting old vessels that they went as far as to dredge them up from the bottom of rivers to retrieve them. Does anyone know of what I'm talking of?

If anyone has any info to offer, please, feel free to fill me and everyone else in, thanks,
Eric (En Rui)
Non-Han Nan Ban
I completely forgot I even created a thread on this about a month and a half ago; otherwise I would have added here what I've already added to the archaeology section of the Song Dynasty on wikipedia:

QUOTE
Despite the gentry's overriding interest in archaeology simply for reviving ancient state rituals, some of Shen's peers took a similar approach to the study of archaeology. His contemporary Ouyang Xiu (1007–1072) compiled an analytical catalogue of ancient rubbings on stone and bronze which pioneered ideas in early epigraphy and archeology.[66] On the unreliability of historical works written after the fact, scholar-official Zhao Mingcheng (1081–1129) stated "...the inscriptions on stone and bronze are made at the time the events took place and can be trusted without reservation, and thus discrepancies may be discovered."[205] Historian R.C. Rudolph states that Zhao's emphasis on consulting contemporary sources for accurate dating is parallel with the concern of the German historian Leopold von Ranke (1795–1886),[205] and was in fact emphasized by many Song scholars.[206] The Song scholar Hong Mai (1123–1202) heavily criticized what he called the court's "ridiculous" archaeological catalogue Bogutu compiled during the Huizong reign periods of Zheng He and Xuan He (1111–1125).[207] Hong Mai obtained old vessels from the Han Dynasty and compared them with the descriptions offered in the catalogue, which he found so inaccurate he stated he had to "hold my sides with laughter."[208] Hong Mai pointed out that the erroneous material was the fault of Chancellor Cai Jing (1047–1126), who prohibited scholars from reading and consulting the written histories.[208]


Good stuff,
Eric (En Rui)
DaMo
Interesting. I believe I also created a topic a long time ago asking about ancient archaeology in China.

Thanks for the info.
Non-Han Nan Ban
No problem. If you can find the thread you started on this subject that would be worth reading as well. There's more substantial information in some journal articles I can bring up if requested, things I did not include over there at wiki.

Eric (En Rui)
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