In Japan they still have Akihito. in most europe countries they also have a running monarchy. UK have a King and Queen of England and even have other Kingdom like Wales. Spanish, Netherland, Monaco, countries of Scandinavian etc also an example of existing King/Queen traditions. in Middle East they have Emirates,Thailand have an undisputed King and in Malaysia they got Sultanate.

lots of monarchy in a world today don;t have political influence to the running goverment. they existed just because it was a tradition and they don't want to stop their rich heritage.

why china,a region with so many dynasties in the past and hail as a longest continuating civilazation, doesn't have a running emperor/monarchy tradition today ?

what happen to the last descendent of china's dynasty in this case a Qing dynasty today? What is Pu-Yi's descendent status right now? are their family get the honour just like other countries,like europe, still honour their nobles family?

while so many attempts to learn and save China's heritages today, are there any attempt to preserve the tradition and the past imperial family China's had?

The last emperor of China Puyi has already passed away. I'm not sure if he has any heir. During the 1930s, the Japanese government installed a puppet regime in Manchuria with Puyi being restored as an emperor, as an attempt to restore monarchy. But after WWII, Puyi was imprisoned for being a 'traitor' to China.

China does not have an emperor now, because it's a republic (i.e. country is ruled by President rather than an emperor). Ever since the 1911 Chinese revolution by Sun Yat Sen (father of republican China), China has progressed from an imperialistic nation to a republic nation. In 1897, there was an attempt to create a constitutional monarch (i.e. preserving the monarchy), but it was not successful. By the time of chinese revolution in 1911, the last emperor had to give in to republicans in China.

do you think this is a big loss of china for not having a running monarchy tradition right now ?

i mean even in a country like indonesia they are still have a running sultanate which enable us to learn how the life of the nobles once in the past. are there any places in china which still run the tradition ? this is will be more a question about preserving a tradition rather than about a form of goverment.

It might be a good way of perserving imperial tradition, but it was inevitable that China's monarch was not going to exist for long because during early ROC period, there was a strong and powerful force against the existence of monarch. China was facing a great historical transition period from imperial age to republican age. So, there was no way in which a monarchy can survive, be revived or even exist. Restoring a monarchy would be akin to acting against historical progression, which clearly wasn't possible at a turmoil times when China was facing internal civil war, invasion from Japan etc.

Japan had a monarch at the same time and ended up modernizing faster than any nation in Asia during the 19th century. What did Japan do right in balancing tradition, national identity, and modernization, that China did wrong?

A figurehead monarch maintained by the PRC? The CCP is all about class struggle, eliminating class differences, and defeating class enemies (well, not so much after the Cultural Revolution); why would they parade around and tout a man similar to Great Britain's King of England? Who represents the epitome of class difference? The ultimate patriarch over society: the emperor? I would be shocked to hear the CCP allow something like this, as it would be perhaps the most visible symbol of the total and unquestionable reversal of the communist order. The PRC still has a facade to maintain, you know.

Eric (En Rui)

one of my question still dont got answer. what happen to the descendent of former imperial family, do they got they still got their honour ? while we keep digging chinese history why we dont heard much about the former imperial family in china ?

Many of the members of the royal family changed their names to avoid persecution after the fall of the dynasty. In an agreement between the Qing dynasty and the republican government established in 1912, the Emperor (Pu Yi) agreed to abdication but allowing the Emperor to retain his title in perpetuality(The Articles of Favorable Treatment after the abdication of the Qing Emperor) and given the accord that a foreign monarch and allowing him to stay in the Forbidden palace and giving him a yearly stipend. In 1924 a warlord forced Pu Yi to leave the forbidden city. However neither the ROC government or the PRC has taken steps to repeal the articles of favorable treatment and as such there's probably someone out that can rightly claim to be the Emperor of the Qing dynasty, but let's face it who would bother?

It also depends on which dynasty of imperial family u like to know...

Interestingly,the descendents of the Han Imperial family are still traceble and are still living in some village(I cannot remember where I have seen this but I am going to find out)

And they are still being honoured by their villagers....

And lets us not forget Yuan Shikai trying to be one.....

Prince Héngzhèn of the Aisin-Gioro clan is the current incumbent leader of the House of Qing.

The Qing Genealogy can be found here.

http://www.4dw.net/royalark/China/manchu12.htm

Here is another article on the current heir to the Qing throne.

Han imperial family, from which dynasty ? i think qing dynasty rule for quite a long time right, that mean the closes would be ming back in 1600's.

about puyi, i read in wiki last night that in 2007 his autobiography would be re print.

That's the million dollar question isn't it? I'd like to hear opinions about that.

I think the reason why the monarchy system in China doesn't exist is due to the fact that many people don't really prefer a dynasty to reign. Not meritocratic nor democratic, if you ask me. In that case, talents in governing a country can never rise to become the holder of power. And, it isn't fair too. A monarchy system would allow heirs to inherit the throne and would one rather prefer an emperor who laze around all day long and takes things for granted, or a person from a humble background but can govern a country well? Besides, the monarchy system can also take a toll on some take-for-granted princes (who thinks that they will inherit their throne), thus destroying their personalities.

Liu Bang

IMHO.

In order to reform, groups of power must either agree to share power or they will fight to defend their power.

Funny enough, Meji restoration was carried by rogue [I say rogue because they went up against the Shogunate] Samurai ranks and Nobles; Warlords[武家] and Nobles [公卿] are the fundamental of Japanese society, throughout history these two groups fought against each other for supremacy, but in Meji restoration, parts of one group allied with the other and thus they are able to carry out their reforms [which really isn't reform. . .] Meji succeed because it [the court] controlled the army.

While the Hundred Days Reform in Chinese history failed due to two reason, the bigger being the 窃国大盗袁世凯 Yuan Shikai's betrayal to the Emperor, while the smaller being Nobles who resisted the reform find ally in the Empress Ci Xi; if the Emperor had the army, it wouldn't of mattered, same as if the Nobles found no standard to carry, they wouldn't of mattered. However, [again, IMHO] since unfortunately for China they hit the jackpot twice.

Conclusion. If you want reform fast, be prepare to do lots of killing.

This sounds interesting. I wonder how the historians manage to track this down? Please kindly let me know if you have found the source. Thank you!

Liu Bang




Is it due to the different mentalities of people? The Chinese are probably scared that a dynasty/monarchy will happen again but the Japanese are not afraid?

What is there to be afraid of? Britain, Denmark, Spain, Japan, all have monarchies and all countries actually have more freedom than China does right now.

From the Han Dynasty...

If by any wild remote chance that China is ever going to restore a monarch (I do not see it necessary and happening at all ) ...

Then the Han dynasty should always be considered first choice then other dynasty for obvious reasons.....




Thank goodness I manage to find the video...

The part showing the it around "2:00"

It claims an old man from a village to be the 73rd descendents of the the 1st emperor of the Han dynasty,Liu Bang....

However it is true that the village shown is Liu Bang's Hometown...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fnHe19Aq_Y

I don't know much about this subject and was just wondering:
Wouldn't it be expensive to maintain a constitutional monarchy? I mean, it seems like royals are paid to do nothing. But like I said, I don't know much of anything about this.

Actually like I said before, these are not a political purpose to raise the tradition. take example of Sultanate in Jogja in Java,island, indonesia. the sultan still have their status and this even can raise income by attracting tourist to visit the palace and see the heritage. it doesnt necessery to make people pay tribute to them just like real monarchy. they can work as regular people.

it just a pity to see a country like Uganda or Tonga still have a "Kingdom" like but Chinese dont have anymore. Just see the list at :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monarchy

These kinds of comparations are very difficult, that is to say, risky. To extract lessons is still more difficult. I offer a few ideas on the way to hypothesis.

- I am doubtful if this has to do with the rate of modernization issue. There is a difference in the fact that the Japanese elites achieved from the start to make belief the divine origin of their imperial family. There was no mandate of Heaven that could be lost; the Emperor descended from the gods, so no chance to think of overthrowing him. At most, the Emperor could be made into a puppet by the military (they did it), but not overthrown. Whereas in China the emperor could loose the mandate of Heaven and if so down with him. The Japanese Imperial institution served as a pivot for the stability of the ruling lord system.

- When the U.S. forced Japan to open the country to international trade, the Japanese were a fully functioning feudal country. The feudal lords got together and decided a strategy for modernization. (Well, not all of them agreed, but the ones who were against were defeated militarily. This was the end of the shogunate and the start of the Meiji restoration). The brightest young men of the clans were sent abroad to learn from the western nations. When they came back they started modernization of industry, commerce and institutions of government, maintaining the power of the feudal families. Again, the Imperial institution served as a center, or rather, a basis for the legitimation of power within the country.

- So there was in Japan a national apparatus of government and decision, which maintained itself firmly in power through the periods of Tokugawa and Meiji and which put in motion and controlled the modernization process, not only to the benefit of the country, but also of itself. This apparatus managed to get some degree of control, by means of diplomatic negotiation, over the attempts of the Western powers to dominate the country. In this way the imposition of extraterritorial legislation for foreigners, for example, was ended.

- Through these means, Japan learned science, technology and political ways, including - unfortunately - imperialism. There has been a strong survival spirit in the Japanese elite from the start of history. It seemed to them that, to survive, Japan had to be as strong as, say, England, France, Germany. Japan, in their view, had to build up industry, a modern army, and behave as those Western powers did.

The rest - oh, well, is there need to remember? The war on China in 1895 was just stretching the military muscles. But it was when the Japanese defeated Russia in 1905 that the militaristic forces in Japan felt they were in the "right" track, and from then on it all developed almost as fatally as a Greek tragedy until Hiroshima and Nagasaki. From 1868 to 1945, Japan modernized to become an imperialistic world power on the model of the West.

- The Ching did not have a command of their country like the Japanese feudal lords did. They were a "foreign" dynasty. They were in a weak position to resist the agressive Western powers. There was the republican movement. China had to live through the transition to republic and the agressor West, then through its civil war and the Japanese agression. There was not a structure holding China together in a comparable way as Japan was held together by the feudal lords - not until after the triumph of the communists in 1949.

- Therefore, the modernization of China was made not on a national strategy but on impulses and accidents. The results can be seen in history. It is only recently that China seems to start having such a strategy. Well. Maybe there were likenesses of strategies before, but they were not the result of a national agreement. I think of the Great Leap Forward, for example.

This looks rather sketchy, right? Right. It is the type of guess that we amateurs do in order to try to understand what is happening.

None of which had an absolute monarchy like the one China had. Emperor is so much different from those king that to return one like a traditional Emperor, it would be a backward step, but to have a figure head, it wouldn't be raise the tradition. Thus, since even if we did return to a constitutional monarchy it wouldn't be returning to tradition then what is the point?

BTW, it is not a pity that China doesn't have a Emperor, in fact I think we are all very glad to be rid of the absolute monarch and have no interest in a constitutional monarchy.

one more questions:

other than the Forbidden City in Beijing, are there any existing palace in other city ? how about in Kaifeng? I remember the Song dynasty ever move their capital to there right? how about famous historical city like Xiangyang or Luoyang, were there still have a remaining palace. are there any ceremonial exhibition for tourism purpose?

I do know of the earlier Imperial Palace of Qing Dynasty in Shenyang (Mukden).