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Genetics of the Vietnamese


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#16 mongobanjum

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Posted 26 January 2009 - 08:43 AM

Let's keep this on topic. It's Genetics of Vietnamese.

Vietnamese are closer to the Dai ethnic group and cluster more with southeast Asians rather than Chinese (though not that distant).

It's relative !

Can you grasp this simple English sentence,is pig-Latin your second language ?

The ones are closer because of mutual ancestry ( same tribes ) not overall general population by all means.


Well the samples were collected in respective East Asian countries (the whole study actually included Africans and Europeans, as well as Oceania and American Indians). The context of the study was not on disease and disease control, so any bias on markers on disease were eliminated.

But, of course, the higher the sample size (should be many thousands to be accurate) would give us a much better indication and more genetic markers (maybe more than the Rosenberg 650K if needed) would provide an even higher resolution and more valid results.

Edited by mongobanjum, 26 January 2009 - 08:48 AM.


#17 Minh

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Posted 26 January 2009 - 10:42 PM

The Chinese speaks a Sino-Tibetan language, the Tai language belongs to the Austronesian family, the Vietnamese: an Austro-Asiatic one, the Korean and Japanese language does not seem to firmly belong to any family. Should we conclude that the ancestors of these groups of people develop their languages in separated area in remote history and therefore is barely related to others genetically ?

#18 MC420

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Posted 27 January 2009 - 01:35 AM

The Chinese speaks a Sino-Tibetan language, the Tai language belongs to the Austronesian family, the Vietnamese: an Austro-Asiatic one, the Korean and Japanese language does not seem to firmly belong to any family. Should we conclude that the ancestors of these groups of people develop their languages in separated area in remote history and therefore is barely related to others genetically ?


Language could change via cultural assimilation process but genetic markers would remain the same. Genetic mapping has grown exponentially recently and it doesn't cost as much as it's used to be. I would strongly urge any of us (with Asian ancestry) to partake in the Genographic Project to discover where our ancestors migrated from. It's not necessary to speculate any further though. ;)

#19 mongobanjum

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Posted 27 January 2009 - 02:32 AM

IMO, language group does have correlations to genetics. The Myers et al. (2008) study on Human Genetic Relationships (see other thread for details) showed an East Asian genetic divide using 650K genetic markers. Austro-Asiatic and Austronesian speaking populations clustered on top center-right, Sino-Tibetan (both Sinic and Tibeto-Burman) speakers clustered on the center-bottom right and those who spoke a Tungusic and/or Mongolic language clustered in the bottom middle-left. The Turkic speaking Yakuts (who live in Sakha Republic in northern Siberia) clustered on the left.

Of course, there can be language shifts between populations with very little migration, but that's still very unlikely.

Edited by mongobanjum, 27 January 2009 - 02:35 AM.


#20 mumbaki

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Posted 27 January 2009 - 03:31 AM

Posted Image

Genetic map using 650K genetic markers (SNP) in East Asia.

Vietnamese are close to Dai ethnic group.

The Chinese Han sample is a mix of northern Chinese (CHB) and southern Chinese.
The Chinese Han dots closer to the Japanese are the northern Chinese (CHB) and the dots closer to the Vietnamese are the southern Chinese. So, as you can see, the northerners are very different from the southerners.

filipinos and borneans also tend to sometimes cluster with southern chinese because some their ancestors are the ones related to ami who came from southern china/taiwan area in the iron age,these people had the most dominant presence in the filipino and bornean culture even in their language although filipinos and borneans also had ancestors in other groups such as polynesians or indochinese or earlier arrivals from taiwan as well,i think this group also had some influence to their neighbors like the vietnamese.

Edited by -遙-, 27 January 2009 - 03:35 AM.


#21 SNK_1408

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 08:07 PM

This claim is overstetched !

There are several advanced ' northern " Neotlithic cultures like Yangshao 仰韶文化 & Hongshan 紅山文化 contributed significantly to Chinese civilization.

http://en.wikipedia....ltures_of_China


many of these cultures also spread to other regions too not just limit to today's China.
Main cradle of Chinese civilization started from yellow river to yangtze river.
역사를 보면 결국 힘있는 자가 힘없는 자를 정복하고 약탈하는 것입니다.
역사를 왜곡하는 민족은 반드시 멸망한다.
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#22 drex44

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 05:27 PM

Hi Minh:

I'm also part of Vietnamese ancestry who came from the south; my ancestors root could be traced back as far as to the 14 Century (in Thanh Hoa). I've participated in the Genographic Project which sponsored by the National Geographic, who utilizes my genetic data to track the migration of my ancestors. Per the Genographic Project, my ancestors (of course initially traveled from the Eastern part of Africa through the Euroasia's steps, crossed south from the modern India, Pakistan's region before the moved north from SE Asia (as I do have distant "cousins" in China & Japan... as well). Basically, my personal genetic data does support the migration pattern of the contemporary Asian folks of moving from the south to the north. I hope this information will be helpful to you regarding your quest.


Chúc mừng năm mới & Happy New Lunar Year to us all! :)


Hi.

About this genetic test, how recent does it go to? Is it "We traced you to this prehistoric hunter-gatherer group" or more like "You are related to this historical group of people"? I guess if it was the latter, a lot of countries would have to rewrite their founding myths. If you can fill me in on how much data they provide, then that'll be great.

Btw I'm Vietnamese American, but I can only trace ancestry to somewhere in North VN/S China six generations. I don't think I'm Chinese since last name is Nguyen, but I might never know.


Thanks.




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